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Todd
PostJune 24, 2026 at 8:10 PM […]
That is probably true.
My point was more that "good" or "bad" have to be attached to concrete choices, not abstractions. Life is good (necessary) for experiencing pleasure. Death is bad for that, but it might be good if you only care about avoiding… -
Cassius
PostJune 24, 2026 at 7:58 PM […]
I could defend that being a related question in the sense that if you think life is not worth living in general then you're not likely to think it's a good idea to bring more children into the world. Strictly speaking I agree they are not the same… -
Todd
PostJune 24, 2026 at 7:41 PM […]
To me, this is not the same question. As I understand it, the question is specifically regarding one's own life or death.
[…]
Are you saying Epicurus teaches life and death are of equal value? If so, I would strongly disagree with that interpretation. -
Don
PostJune 24, 2026 at 7:12 PM Oh! Yeah, don't watch the whole video on that link I posted. If you do go over there, definitely skip ahead to 49:30 for just the short section of the discussion of life vs death. -
Todd
PostJune 24, 2026 at 7:02 PM […]
This would be my first reaction also. -
Cassius
PostJune 24, 2026 at 6:58 PM […]
But sadiy and tragically, some don't, and they carry out what Lucretius mentioned some do .... which is why i don't accept the persuasiveness of PH -- but let's not get sidetracked on that.
[…]
I'm glad you made that comment because I was not… -
Kalosyni
PostJune 24, 2026 at 6:53 PM […]
This question could come up when considering whether to have children or to not have children. If the state of living is more valuable on a philosophical level, then you might be pressured to have children because of that. But if "life" vs "not life"… -
Todd
PostJune 24, 2026 at 6:48 PM […]
Yes, in a sense...but maybe the sense in which I see it is not the sense in which you meant it...
The desire to pursue pleasure (and thus life) is so deeply embedded in the human psyche, that even people who have convinced themselves that they should … -
Todd
PostJune 24, 2026 at 6:00 PM […]
It's important to understand your objective.
In this kind of debate, you are often not really trying to convince the person you're arguing with. You are rather trying to convince others who are (or will be) observing the debate.
And in that case, I… -
Cassius
PostJune 24, 2026 at 5:25 PM […]
I think you are right. Logic can be used in support of the idea that life is better than death, but it can also be used for the reverse. Ultimately it is not logic but FEELING which is the key element. -
Todd
PostJune 24, 2026 at 5:22 PM […]
It is quite possible to arrive at this conclusion without any logical inconsistencies. For example, if you believe your telos to be removal of pain, then it would be perfectly consistent to see death as a shortcut to that end. In that case, death… -
Cassius
PostJune 24, 2026 at 4:18 PM […]
Another excellent use of self-contradiction, showing that they are either not a consistent thinker or being intentionally misleading.
Presuming they are more on the "not consistent thinker" edge of the range, for reasons that we might choose to find… -
Todd
PostJune 24, 2026 at 4:02 PM […]
Such a person must be alive in order to say that, thus demonstrating their preference for being alive, and contradicting their claim. -
Cassius
PostJune 24, 2026 at 3:38 PM -
Cassius
PostJune 24, 2026 at 2:30 PM I don't recall whether I got to watch that full debate last time but I'll get to it this time. Thankfully Jordan Peterson seems to be fading away. Hopefully we can express some of the issues in this thread for those who don't watch the video or just… -
Don
PostJune 24, 2026 at 2:26 PM -
Kalosyni
June 24, 2026 at 1:47 PM Replied to the thread Comparing Modern Ideas vs Epicurean Ideas on Well-being and Joy.PostPatrikios - Here is are some comparisons to textual references in Epicurean philosophy, mapped according to some of the points in Post 1 above (although some of these may be more loosely related)...
Cultivate Gratitude
“The wealth demanded by nature… -
Cassius
ThreadJune 24, 2026 at 12:57 PM Stated another way, such a person might say:- There is nothing preferable about being alive over being dead.
- The status of being dead and being alive are essentially equal.
- Since we are going to be "dead" or "not alive" for a lot more time than we will be
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Cassius
June 24, 2026 at 10:19 AM Replied to the thread Nietzsche's Eternal Recurrence (Eternal Return) In Relation To Lucretius.Post[…]
As Joshua likes to say on the podcast - "WHAT!!!????"
I don't see that implication at all. There's no presumption that you have lived in a bed of roses, only that you would prefer to live and experience SOME pleasure, even at the cost of some pain,… -
Kalosyni
June 24, 2026 at 8:30 AM Replied to the thread Nietzsche's Eternal Recurrence (Eternal Return) In Relation To Lucretius.Post[…]
[…]
The implication here is that "externals" are not important, but does this end up taking on a "stoic" flavor, especially as an aspect of "eternal return" is accepting what has happened no matter how bad. -
Patrikios
June 23, 2026 at 3:19 PM Replied to the thread Comparing Modern Ideas vs Epicurean Ideas on Well-being and Joy.Post[…]
Kalosyni
Once again, you find lovely ways to remind us just how relevant the Epicurean teachings are to living a modern healthy life filled with eudaimonia!
It appears that each of those 4 major groupings and most all of the sub-topics could be… -
Cassius
June 23, 2026 at 1:20 PM Replied to the thread Nietzsche's Eternal Recurrence (Eternal Return) In Relation To Lucretius.PostNietzsche is all over the board at various phases of his life but I find this to be consistently stated by every commentator I have seen, so I think it is correct:
Its purpose is to test your life-affirmation;
In other words, it is a test for your… -
Kalosyni
June 23, 2026 at 11:49 AM Replied to the thread Nietzsche's Eternal Recurrence (Eternal Return) In Relation To Lucretius.PostTrying to understand "eternal recurrence" and found this from Google:
[…]
This brings up more questions for reflection that are not found in Epicurean philosophy. -
Don
June 23, 2026 at 8:21 AM Replied to the thread Nietzsche's Eternal Recurrence (Eternal Return) In Relation To Lucretius.PostOkay, this is good. I am genuinely curious to follow up on a couple points you made:
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Are there instances of people "seeing death as the ultimate reward of life rather than pleasure"?
[…]
I need to go back and read deeper maybe, but is someone like… -
Cassius
June 23, 2026 at 7:55 AM Replied to the thread Nietzsche's Eternal Recurrence (Eternal Return) In Relation To Lucretius.PostWhile the "big picture" issue of how to present Epicurus was what spurred my additions to this thread, I do think it is probably also worth confirming issues raised in the quoted section which presumed a negative answer:
(1) Would we wish to live… -
Cassius
June 23, 2026 at 7:11 AM Replied to the thread Nietzsche's Eternal Recurrence (Eternal Return) In Relation To Lucretius.PostYes I will readily admit that some people come at this for reasons that are understandable due to unfortunate personal situations, and I have no desire to criticize any individual who may be sincerely in a bad place or mistaken as to their rhetoric.
But… -
Don
June 22, 2026 at 11:13 PM Replied to the thread Nietzsche's Eternal Recurrence (Eternal Return) In Relation To Lucretius.Post[…]
[…]
I'll concede that some people do want to smuggle in Buddhist or Stoic ideas into Epicurus' philosophy, and this is not the right way to go. However, I have come to see that not all whose concern or focus is "relief from pain" are doing this. To… -
Cassius
June 22, 2026 at 8:34 PM Replied to the thread Nietzsche's Eternal Recurrence (Eternal Return) In Relation To Lucretius.PostToday I finally made some progress in reviewing the book "Nietzsche and Epicurus." I am probably only about half way through it. While there is definitely a lot of useful information in it, at least at the present I would not recommend it.
Here's an… -
Carrilho
June 22, 2026 at 11:06 AM Has solved the quiz Basic Epicurean Ethics.Quiz -
Carrilho
June 22, 2026 at 11:03 AM Has solved the quiz Basic Epicurean Canonics.Quiz -
Carrilho
June 22, 2026 at 10:59 AM Has solved the quiz Basic Epicurean Physics.Quiz -
Cassius
June 22, 2026 at 4:05 AM Replied to the thread Happy Birthday General Thread.PostHappy Birthday to KevinC! Learn more about KevinC and say happy birthday on KevinC's timeline: KevinC -
Cassius
June 22, 2026 at 4:05 AM Replied to the thread Happy Birthday General Thread.PostHappy Birthday to Creative Air! Learn more about Creative Air and say happy birthday on Creative Air's timeline: Creative Air -
Bryan
June 22, 2026 at 2:49 AM Replied to the thread Bryan Harris Interlinear Translation Of Lucretius.PostThis is a rough version of Book Two.
The next book will take a year. -
Cassius
June 21, 2026 at 4:44 PM Replied to the thread Article - David Sedley - 1988 - "Epicurean Anti-Reductionism".PostSignificant discussion recently here on the forum about emergence and Epicurus' opposition to Democritus' atomic reductionism, so just bumping this thread to remind people of the existence of this article by David Sedley directly on point.
[…] -
Kalosyni
June 21, 2026 at 12:23 PM Replied to the thread PD24 - Commentary and Translation of PD 24.PostThis may need it's own thread, but currently this section of the forum is set up so that no new threads can be added.
Does Principal Doctrine 24 & 25, describe how "principled action" is arrived at?
(24) "...And if among the mental images created by your… -
Autoataraxic
June 21, 2026 at 8:43 AM Replied to the thread Welcome AutoAtaraxic!.PostThanks everyone. My own research showed Clinamen Vitae to be a fairly modern term, but I asked in case I missed anything. I came across the Latin term myself when I coined the term 'life swerve' as an analogy of the swerve of the atom, in which we can… -
TauPhi
June 20, 2026 at 8:58 PM Replied to the thread So You Want To Learn Ancient Greek Or Latin?.PostPart of Lucretius' Book 3 Proem sang in classical Latin pronunciation to some medieval-like music. Lovely stuff.
youtube.com/watch?v=9uW0PaQqglg -
Cassius
June 20, 2026 at 5:09 PM Posted the thread Updates To Participation Level Designations.ThreadToday we are making changes to our forum participation levels to make the titles more informative. The full details are on our Community Stands, Participation Levels, And Posting Policies page. The relevant part is reproduced below.2. Participation
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Cassius
ThreadJune 20, 2026 at 2:48 PM Welcome to Episode 339 of Lucretius Today. This is a podcast dedicated to the poet Lucretius, who wrote "On The Nature of Things," the most complete presentation of Epicurean philosophy left to us from the ancient world. Each week we walk you through the… -
Cassius
ThreadJune 20, 2026 at 8:57 AM
I've been looking at several aspects of reorganization of the forum, and I thought it would be useful to highlight ways in which Epicurus himself as a model was not just an individual thinker but as a primary part of his effort was working with others… -
Kalosyni
June 20, 2026 at 8:55 AM Posted the thread Happy Twentieth of June 2026!.Thread
Happy Twentieth Everyone! Wishing everyone a beautiful day filled with all the things that make life wonderful!
And tomorrow is Summer Solstice!
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Elli
June 19, 2026 at 2:31 PM Wrote the blog article The Letter of Epicurus to His Mother.Blog ArticleThe Letter of Epicurus to His Mother
Diogenes of Oinoanda (fr. 125–126) – Free rendering
Mother, concerning everything that troubles you, I want you to form clear and confident thoughts. The images we see in dreams - especially when they concern things not… -
Cassius
June 19, 2026 at 2:31 PM Replied to the thread Episode 338 - EATAQ20 - Are Knowledge And Wisdom Available Only To Gods?.PostEpisode 338 of the Lucretius Today Podcast is now available. This week our episode is entitled: "Are Knowledge And Wisdom Available Only To Gods?"
[media]https://www.spreaker.com/episode/72603581/media -
Cassius
June 17, 2026 at 9:32 PM Replied to the thread Prolepsis and the Epicurean Gods (discussion split from earlier thread started by Titus).Post[…]
No no not at all directed at you - it's just a general reference to a topic that's regularly on my mind - how to balance competing priorities. This topic has covered a lot of ground and that comment arose from my constantly thinking about how to… -
DaveT
June 17, 2026 at 7:46 PM Replied to the thread Prolepsis and the Epicurean Gods (discussion split from earlier thread started by Titus).Post[…]
I'm not sure how to take this comment to my statement above. Please explain if you are speaking to me as "one of those"? -
Cassius
June 17, 2026 at 7:08 AM Replied to the thread Relationship between AI/LLMs and prolepsis.Post[…]
i agree with Peter K's post and "liked it." I singled out this sentense only because I don't think he meant to imply that animals are not conscious, or only a "human" brain can be conscious. If you did mean that Peter please correct me, but I took… -
Cassius
June 17, 2026 at 7:02 AM Replied to the thread Relationship between AI/LLMs and prolepsis.Post[…]
At least at present that's the way I am seeing a relationship that is productive to discuss.
No doubt there are many differences, but i would not underestimate the significance of even this short part of Martin's statement.
When the major other… -
Peter Konstans
June 17, 2026 at 6:58 AM Replied to the thread Relationship between AI/LLMs and prolepsis.PostIf prolepsis is roughly equivalent to the notion of pattern recognition that our cognition relies on, then AI is just the collective pool of human prolepsis, a machine packed with enormous quantities of information that humans use as an auxiliary for…
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