Using Google AI to generate translation of ancient Greek words

FWIW: From my translation/commentary

131j. ἀλλὰ τὸ μήτε ἀλγεῖν κατὰ σῶμα μήτε ταράττεσθαι κατὰ ψυχήν·

• σῶμα "one's body; one's material life in the physical world"
• ταράττεσθαι < τᾰρᾰ́ττω, Attic form of ταράσσω (tarassō) "trouble, disturb, upset"
  • ταράττεσθαι (Attic form) < ταράττεσθαι (middle/passive infinitive)
  • This word is connected to αταραξία (ataraxia) < ἀ- (a- “not”) +‎ ταράσσω (tarássō “trouble, disturb”) +‎ -ῐ́ᾱ
• "but that which neither pains the body (σῶμα sōma) nor troubles the mind (ψυχήν psykhēn)."

In thinking about this a little more, my fervent plea is to not rely on AI to answer a question like this. I would be suspect whether it was actually parsing an ancient Greek word or defaulting to modern Greek definitions. In this specific test case, it at least stuck with ancient Greek although in examining the sources references we find:

1. http://www.ldysinger.com/Evagrius/03_Pr…_prayer_all.htm - "Webpage was created for a workshop held at Saint Andrew's Abbey, Valyermo, California in 1997" Item 92 has the word in question: not become agitated but these are all Christian prayers. The main page http://www.ldysinger.com/ shows this is from a Christian seminary workshop.

2. https://sites.temple.edu/dwolf/files/20…-Telos-6.10.pdf - This is more promising as it is actually a paper on Epicurus by a professor of philosophy at Temple University in Philadelphia. The word in question is actually quoted from the letter to Menoikeus. This could be worth reading in full as the author says "I claim that Epicurus does not hold the view that telic pleasure is simply an absence of pain or disturbance." However, if we pass this over in a reliance on AI to simply scrape it for our question, we might miss out on something valuable.

The New Testament question is interesting, but I would suggest caution. I've done this myself, but we also have to remember that word meanings change over time and there are a couple centuries between Epicurus and Paul and the other writers of the New Testament. In thinking about this a little more, it might be more applicable to ask where words in Epicurus show up in the Septuagint, the Greek translation of the Hebrew Bible, since it was composed closer to Epicurus' time. That just occurred to me as I was writing. In any case, the sources "referenced" by the AI are all simply different websites that reference Strong's Concordance entry #5015. That's a fine source, but the AI is pointing to multiple sites with the same information, making it look like it found several different citations when it really only found Strong's.

If you have a question about an ancient Greek word in a text, my suggestion would be to:

- Copy and paste the word into Wiktionary: In this case, the word itself doesn't come up, BUT if you start chopping from the end, you get https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/%CF%84%CE…%83%CF%83%CF%89

- Just type the word into Google and assess the actual search results: https://www.google.com/search?client=…bih=559&dpr=1.5

In this case, Logeion comes up first and also a site with Strong's Concordance.

Adding in site:edu brings up several academic papers with the word, including ones using the Letter to Menoikeus. You can even use a Google search like (try it, copy and paste this into a Google search bar):

ταράττεσθαι site:edu intext:menoeceus -ai

and that puts the word into context within some academic papers.

I simply don't trust a generative AI using an LLM to provide trustworthy answers in and of itself. Okay, tracking down the actual sites it has scavenged from across the Internet may be helpful, but its extruded text based on word probabilities... I'm not going to trust it to "compose" a text-based answer. I'm going to evaluate WHERE it's getting its words that it smooshed together, worked on probabilities for what tokens come after each other, and strung together what it came up with. And, if that's the case, I'm going to search for the sources themselves from the start rather than put my trust in an automaton mediating access to actual sources.

I hope I didn't come across too harshly! I'll admit discussions of AI can raise my hackles. The AI summaries sometimes uncover interesting references (like that paper). But those don't necessarily need AI to find, just good searching skills.

Quote from Kalosyni

When investigating the word ταράττεσθαι (tarattesthai), I wanted to get as far away as possible from the word ataraxia. Ataraxia says nothing about what is to be removed or avoided.

Fair enough, but seeing Epicurus' choice of words in context is important, too. The fact that he wanted to use ταράττεσθαι rather than another word I feel is important.

As for ataraxia, a few of the AI references are pointing back to discussions on this forum and the FB group. That becomes circular.

Here's an old post showing occurrences of ataraxia in the texts:

Post

RE: Every Instance of "Ataraxia," "Eudaemonia," and "Tranquilatas" in a Core Epicurean Text

ΑΤΑΡΑΞΙΑ (Ataraxia and related terms: Note that αταραξια is literally "ataraksia" even though the usual English spelling is "ataraxia." Therefore, words that have atarak- are directly related.

From ἀ- (a-, “not”) +‎ ταράσσω (tarássō, “trouble, disturb”) +‎ -ῐ́ᾱ (-íā); Antonyms: τᾰρᾰχή (tarakhḗ)

http://www.perseus.tufts.edu/hopper/text?do…ntry=a)taraci/a

PD17 One who acts aright is utterly steady and serene, whereas one who goes astray is full of trouble and confusion. (Peter Saint-Andre)

ὁ…

Don

February 19, 2023 at 10:28 PM

I asked Google the difference, if any, between Google AI and Gemini. Here, for anyone interested (who didn;t already know, as I didn’t), is the reply from Google AI (I didn’t inquire further):

“Gemini is the ‘brain’ (the AI model), while Google AI Mode is a feature (an enhanced search experience) inside Google Search that uses Gemini to answer your questions.Here is how they differ:

“Gemini (accessed via Google Gemini) is a standalone AI chatbot and large language model. It is designed for deep, multi-step tasks, long conversations, and writing assistance.

“Google AI Mode is an interface built directly into the Google Search bar. Instead of just giving you a list of links, it uses Gemini in the background to browse the live web, synthesize answers, and let you ask follow-up questions. It also acts dynamically, building custom interactive layouts or calculators right in your search results.

In short: You are chatting with Gemini when you use Google AI Mode, but AI Mode is specifically tuned for fast web research and live information.”

__________________________

I usually do not restrict myself to the AI mode when using Google (though I don’t alwaysI disable it with the -ai command). Then, at least, I can compare the AI response to other sources. I sometimes use Gemini on my phone for quick questions: e.g., “Who did Miguel Amaya play for before the Cubs?"