1. Home
    1. Start Here: Study Guide
    2. Community Standards And Posting Policies
    3. Terms of Use
    4. Moderator Team
    5. Site Map
    6. Quizzes
    7. Articles
      1. Featured Articles
    8. All Blog Posts
      1. Elli's Blog / Articles
  2. Wiki
    1. Wiki Home
    2. FAQ
    3. Classical Epicureanism
    4. Files
    5. Search Assistance
    6. Not NeoEpicurean
    7. Foundations
    8. Navigation Outlines
    9. Key Pages
  3. Forum
    1. Full Forum List
    2. Welcome Threads
    3. Physics
    4. Canonics
    5. Ethics
    6. Uncategorized Forum
    7. Study Resources Forum
    8. Ancient Texts Forum
    9. Shortcuts
    10. Featured
    11. Most Discussed
  4. Latest
    1. New Activity
    2. Latest Threads
    3. Dashboard
    4. Search By Tag
    5. Complete Tag List
  5. Podcast
    1. Lucretius Today Podcast
    2. Episode Guide
    3. Lucretius Today At Youtube
    4. EpicureanFriends Youtube Page
  6. Texts
    1. Overview
    2. Diogenes Laertius
    3. Principal Doctrines
    4. Vatican Collection
    5. Lucretius
    6. Herodotus
    7. Pythocles
    8. Menoeceus
    9. Fragments - Usener Collection
    10. Torquatus On Ethics
    11. Velleius On Gods
    12. Greek/Latin Help
  7. Gallery
    1. Featured images
    2. Albums
    3. Latest Images
    4. Latest Comments
  8. Calendar
    1. Upcoming Events List
    2. Zoom Meetings
    3. This Month
    4. Sunday Zoom Meetings
    5. First Monday Zoom Meetings
    6. Wednesday Zoom Meeting
    7. Twentieth Zoom Meetings
    8. Zoom Meetings
  9. Other
    1. Featured Content
    2. Blog Posts
    3. Logbook
    4. EF ToDo List
    5. Link-Database
  • Login
  • Register
  • Search
This Thread
  • Everywhere
  • This Thread
  • This Forum
  • Forum
  • Articles
  • Blog Articles
  • Files
  • Gallery
  • Events
  • Pages
  • Wiki
  • Help
  • FAQ
  • More Options

Welcome To EpicureanFriends.com!

"Remember that you are mortal, and you have a limited time to live, and in devoting yourself to discussion of the nature of time and eternity you have seen things that have been, are now, and are to come."

Sign In Now
or
Register a new account
  1. Home
    1. Start Here: Study Guide
    2. Community Standards And Posting Policies
    3. Terms of Use
    4. Moderator Team
    5. Site Map
    6. Quizzes
    7. Articles
      1. Featured Articles
    8. All Blog Posts
      1. Elli's Blog / Articles
  2. Wiki
    1. Wiki Home
    2. FAQ
    3. Classical Epicureanism
    4. Files
    5. Search Assistance
    6. Not NeoEpicurean
    7. Foundations
    8. Navigation Outlines
    9. Key Pages
  3. Forum
    1. Full Forum List
    2. Welcome Threads
    3. Physics
    4. Canonics
    5. Ethics
    6. Uncategorized Forum
    7. Study Resources Forum
    8. Ancient Texts Forum
    9. Shortcuts
    10. Featured
    11. Most Discussed
  4. Latest
    1. New Activity
    2. Latest Threads
    3. Dashboard
    4. Search By Tag
    5. Complete Tag List
  5. Podcast
    1. Lucretius Today Podcast
    2. Episode Guide
    3. Lucretius Today At Youtube
    4. EpicureanFriends Youtube Page
  6. Texts
    1. Overview
    2. Diogenes Laertius
    3. Principal Doctrines
    4. Vatican Collection
    5. Lucretius
    6. Herodotus
    7. Pythocles
    8. Menoeceus
    9. Fragments - Usener Collection
    10. Torquatus On Ethics
    11. Velleius On Gods
    12. Greek/Latin Help
  7. Gallery
    1. Featured images
    2. Albums
    3. Latest Images
    4. Latest Comments
  8. Calendar
    1. Upcoming Events List
    2. Zoom Meetings
    3. This Month
    4. Sunday Zoom Meetings
    5. First Monday Zoom Meetings
    6. Wednesday Zoom Meeting
    7. Twentieth Zoom Meetings
    8. Zoom Meetings
  9. Other
    1. Featured Content
    2. Blog Posts
    3. Logbook
    4. EF ToDo List
    5. Link-Database
  1. Home
    1. Start Here: Study Guide
    2. Community Standards And Posting Policies
    3. Terms of Use
    4. Moderator Team
    5. Site Map
    6. Quizzes
    7. Articles
      1. Featured Articles
    8. All Blog Posts
      1. Elli's Blog / Articles
  2. Wiki
    1. Wiki Home
    2. FAQ
    3. Classical Epicureanism
    4. Files
    5. Search Assistance
    6. Not NeoEpicurean
    7. Foundations
    8. Navigation Outlines
    9. Key Pages
  3. Forum
    1. Full Forum List
    2. Welcome Threads
    3. Physics
    4. Canonics
    5. Ethics
    6. Uncategorized Forum
    7. Study Resources Forum
    8. Ancient Texts Forum
    9. Shortcuts
    10. Featured
    11. Most Discussed
  4. Latest
    1. New Activity
    2. Latest Threads
    3. Dashboard
    4. Search By Tag
    5. Complete Tag List
  5. Podcast
    1. Lucretius Today Podcast
    2. Episode Guide
    3. Lucretius Today At Youtube
    4. EpicureanFriends Youtube Page
  6. Texts
    1. Overview
    2. Diogenes Laertius
    3. Principal Doctrines
    4. Vatican Collection
    5. Lucretius
    6. Herodotus
    7. Pythocles
    8. Menoeceus
    9. Fragments - Usener Collection
    10. Torquatus On Ethics
    11. Velleius On Gods
    12. Greek/Latin Help
  7. Gallery
    1. Featured images
    2. Albums
    3. Latest Images
    4. Latest Comments
  8. Calendar
    1. Upcoming Events List
    2. Zoom Meetings
    3. This Month
    4. Sunday Zoom Meetings
    5. First Monday Zoom Meetings
    6. Wednesday Zoom Meeting
    7. Twentieth Zoom Meetings
    8. Zoom Meetings
  9. Other
    1. Featured Content
    2. Blog Posts
    3. Logbook
    4. EF ToDo List
    5. Link-Database
  1. EpicureanFriends - Home of Classical Epicurean Philosophy
  2. Forum
  3. Ancient Texts Relevant To Epicurus
  4. Collections - Usener, The "Suda," and "The Greek Anthology"
  5. "The Greek Anthology"
  • Sidebar
  • Sidebar

Epigrams on Atomism

  • Joshua
  • December 10, 2020 at 9:33 PM
  • Go to last post

We are now requiring that new registrants confirm their request for an account by email.  Once you complete the "Sign Up" process to set up your user name and password, please send an email to the New Accounts Administator to obtain new account approval.

Regularly Checking In On A Small Screen Device? Bookmark THIS page!
  • Joshua
    05 - Administrator
    Points
    15,104
    Posts
    1,922
    Quizzes
    3
    Quiz rate
    95.8 %
    • December 10, 2020 at 9:33 PM
    • #1

    Book XI - Convivial and Satirical Epigrams

    No. 50 - Automedon

    Quote

    "Blest is he first who owes naught to anyone, next he who never married, and thirdly he who is childless. But if a man be mad enough to marry, it is a blessing for him if he buries his wife at once after getting a handsome dowry. Knowing this, be wise, and leave Epicurus to enquire in vain where is the void and what are the atoms."

    Translated W. R. Paton

  • Joshua
    05 - Administrator
    Points
    15,104
    Posts
    1,922
    Quizzes
    3
    Quiz rate
    95.8 %
    • December 10, 2020 at 9:40 PM
    • #2

    Book XI - Convivial and Satirical Epigrams

    No. 93 - Lucilius

    Quote

    "Lean Marcus once made a hole with his head in one of Epicurus' atoms and went through the middle of it."

    Translated W. R. Paton

  • Joshua
    05 - Administrator
    Points
    15,104
    Posts
    1,922
    Quizzes
    3
    Quiz rate
    95.8 %
    • December 10, 2020 at 9:48 PM
    • #3

    Book XI - Convivial and Satirical Epigrams

    No. 103 - Lucilius

    Quote

    Epicurus wrote that all the world consisted of atoms, thinking, Alcimus, that an atom was the most minute thing. But if Diophantus had existed then he would have written that it consisted of Diophantus, who is much more minute than the atoms. Or he would have written that other things were composed of atoms, but the atoms themselves, Alcimus, of Diophantus.

    Translated W. R. Paton

  • Joshua
    05 - Administrator
    Points
    15,104
    Posts
    1,922
    Quizzes
    3
    Quiz rate
    95.8 %
    • December 10, 2020 at 9:59 PM
    • #4

    Book XI - Convivial and Satirical Epigrams

    No. 249 - Lucilius

    Quote

    "Menophanes bought a field, and from hunger hanged himself on another man's oak. When he was dead they had no earth to throw over him from above, but he was buried for payment in the ground of one of his neighbors. If Epicurus had known of Menophanes' field he would have said that everything is full of fields, not of atoms."

    Translated W. R. Paton

  • Cassius
    05 - Administrator
    Points
    106,710
    Posts
    14,656
    Quizzes
    9
    Quiz rate
    100.0 %
    • December 10, 2020 at 11:15 PM
    • #5

    Those are wild but I am not sure at all to make out of Book 10 number 249

  • Joshua
    05 - Administrator
    Points
    15,104
    Posts
    1,922
    Quizzes
    3
    Quiz rate
    95.8 %
    • December 10, 2020 at 11:30 PM
    • #6

    Apart from being merely ironic and satirical, I can think of one fact in connection with Menophanes' proverbially tiny field. The Ancient Greeks did not use primogeniture where the eldest son is awarded the estate. Instead they divided the land among all of the heirs. As the generations went by, each parcel was subdivided again and again with every successive death in the family, until they became so small as to be entirely unusable. The Greek solution to this problem was to pack a bunch of smallholders onto a ship and send them off to start a colony on empty land somewhere.

    This was, in fact, the fate of Neocles and his family. Neocles was born in Gargettos seven miles outside of Athens, but was sent to the island of Samos where a colony was founded.

    But I wouldn't read too much into any of these! Lucilius has dozens like these two, where he satirizes people's stature and appearance.

  • Don
    ΕΠΙΚΟΥΡΕΙΟΣ (Epicurist)
    Points
    41,255
    Posts
    5,746
    Quizzes
    9
    Quiz rate
    92.8 %
    • December 11, 2020 at 10:52 AM
    • #7
    Quote from JJElbert

    Book XI - Convivial and Satirical Epigrams

    No. 50 - Automedon

    Quote

    "Blest is he first who owes naught to anyone, next he who never married, and thirdly he who is childless. But if a man be mad enough to marry, it is a blessing for him if he buries his wife at once after getting a handsome dowry. Knowing this, be wise, and leave Epicurus to enquire in vain where is the void and what are the atoms."

    Translated W. R. Paton

    Display More

    While I don't endorse the overall sentiment in any way (for the record), I find it interesting that "blest" is used to translate the first word Ευδαίμων Eudaimōn (i.e., Eudaimonia).

  • Joshua
    05 - Administrator
    Points
    15,104
    Posts
    1,922
    Quizzes
    3
    Quiz rate
    95.8 %
    • December 11, 2020 at 1:00 PM
    • #8
    Quote

    While I don't endorse the overall sentiment in any way

    Ha! Certainly not. A lot of these epigrammatists were very sour. I'll start posting Palladas next week. He has a few good ones but most of his are even worse than this.

  • Joshua
    05 - Administrator
    Points
    15,104
    Posts
    1,922
    Quizzes
    3
    Quiz rate
    95.8 %
    • December 11, 2020 at 1:31 PM
    • #9

    Also for the record, by the words "enquire in vain" I'm inferring that Automedon was being dismissive of Epicurus and his philosophy.

  • Cassius
    05 - Administrator
    Points
    106,710
    Posts
    14,656
    Quizzes
    9
    Quiz rate
    100.0 %
    • December 11, 2020 at 4:22 PM
    • #10

    Yes it seems like the majority of these are anti Epicurean but that does not mean they aren't valuable. Maybe we need a warning in the first post or the thread

Unread Threads

    1. Title
    2. Replies
    3. Last Reply
    1. Studies on Epicurus' Influence on Marx 14

      • Love 1
      • Titus
      • May 11, 2020 at 1:35 PM
      • Comparing Epicurus With Other Philosophers - General Discussion
      • Titus
      • October 21, 2025 at 9:33 AM
    2. Replies
      14
      Views
      9.1k
      14
    3. DaveT

      October 21, 2025 at 9:33 AM
    1. The Nature of the Mind, the Spirit, and Death 1

      • Like 3
      • Kalosyni
      • March 11, 2024 at 9:27 AM
      • Book 3
      • Kalosyni
      • October 19, 2025 at 4:55 PM
    2. Replies
      1
      Views
      2.3k
      1
    3. Kalosyni

      October 19, 2025 at 4:55 PM
    1. What Are Some Epicurean Tips to Deal With Anxiety Over Painful Scenarios? 4

      • Thanks 1
      • SillyApe
      • October 18, 2025 at 11:52 AM
      • Uncategorized Discussion (General)
      • SillyApe
      • October 19, 2025 at 1:01 PM
    2. Replies
      4
      Views
      379
      4
    3. SillyApe

      October 19, 2025 at 1:01 PM
    1. New Youtube Video - "Epicurus Responding to His Haters" - October 2025 4

      • Like 2
      • Cassius
      • October 5, 2025 at 3:55 PM
      • Uncategorized Discussion (General)
      • Cassius
      • October 17, 2025 at 10:39 AM
    2. Replies
      4
      Views
      1.2k
      4
    3. Cassius

      October 17, 2025 at 10:39 AM
    1. Preparing A Public Domain Audio And Text Version Lucretius In Modern American English 4

      • Cassius
      • October 16, 2025 at 2:42 PM
      • General Discussion of "On The Nature of Things"
      • Cassius
      • October 16, 2025 at 3:24 PM
    2. Replies
      4
      Views
      381
      4
    3. Cassius

      October 16, 2025 at 3:24 PM

Finding Things At EpicureanFriends.com

What's the best strategy for finding things on EpicureanFriends.com? Here's a suggested search strategy:

  • First, familiarize yourself with the list of forums. The best way to find threads related to a particular topic is to look in the relevant forum. Over the years most people have tried to start threads according to forum topic, and we regularly move threads from our "general discussion" area over to forums with more descriptive titles.
  • Use the "Search" facility at the top right of every page. Note that the search box asks you what section of the forum you'd like to search. If you don't know, select "Everywhere." Also check the "Search Assistance" page.
  • Use the "Tag" facility, starting with the "Key Tags By Topic" in the right hand navigation pane, or using the "Search By Tag" page, or the "Tag Overview" page which contains a list of all tags alphabetically. We curate the available tags to keep them to a manageable number that is descriptive of frequently-searched topics.

Resources

  1. Getting Started At EpicureanFriends
  2. Community Standards And Posting Policies
  3. The Major Doctrines of Classical Epicurean Philosophy
  4. Introductory Videos
  5. Wiki
  6. Lucretius Today Podcast
    1. Podcast Episode Guide
  7. Key Epicurean Texts
    1. Side-By-Side Diogenes Laertius X (Bio And All Key Writings of Epicurus)
    2. Side-By-Side Lucretius - On The Nature Of Things
    3. Lucretius Topical Outline
    4. Fragment Collection
  8. Frequently Asked Questions
    1. FAQ Discussions
  9. Full List of Forums
    1. Physics Discussions
    2. Canonics Discussions
    3. Ethics Discussions
    4. All Recent Forum Activities
  10. Image Gallery
  11. Featured Articles
  12. Featured Blog Posts
  13. Quiz Section
  14. Activities Calendar
  15. Special Resource Pages
  16. File Database
  17. Site Map
    1. Home

Frequently Used Forums

  • Frequently Asked / Introductory Questions
  • News And Announcements
  • Lucretius Today Podcast
  • Physics (The Nature of the Universe)
  • Canonics (The Tests Of Truth)
  • Ethics (How To Live)
  • Against Determinism
  • Against Skepticism
  • The "Meaning of Life" Question
  • Uncategorized Discussion
  • Comparisons With Other Philosophies
  • Historical Figures
  • Ancient Texts
  • Decline of The Ancient Epicurean Age
  • Unsolved Questions of Epicurean History
  • Welcome New Participants
  • Events - Activism - Outreach
  • Full Forum List

Latest Posts

  • Happy Birthday General Thread

    Rolf October 23, 2025 at 2:42 AM
  • Do you believe in psychological hedonism/egoism? Any philosophers on this?

    Adrastus October 23, 2025 at 12:14 AM
  • Reasoning through the Letter to Menoeceus' On the Gods

    Eikadistes October 22, 2025 at 12:02 PM
  • Should Epicureans Celebrate Something Else Instead of Celebrating Halloween?

    Adrastus October 21, 2025 at 10:30 PM
  • Studies on Epicurus' Influence on Marx

    DaveT October 21, 2025 at 9:33 AM
  • Happy Twentieth of October 2025

    Kalosyni October 20, 2025 at 9:16 AM
  • The Nature of the Mind, the Spirit, and Death

    Kalosyni October 19, 2025 at 4:55 PM
  • Episode 302 - TD30 - Epicurus and Roads Paved With Good Intentions

    Cassius October 19, 2025 at 4:34 PM
  • What Are Some Epicurean Tips to Deal With Anxiety Over Painful Scenarios?

    SillyApe October 19, 2025 at 1:01 PM
  • Welcome Zarathustra!

    Zarathustra October 19, 2025 at 3:17 AM

Frequently Used Tags

In addition to posting in the appropriate forums, participants are encouraged to reference the following tags in their posts:

  • #Physics
    • #Atomism
    • #Gods
    • #Images
    • #Infinity
    • #Eternity
    • #Life
    • #Death
  • #Canonics
    • #Knowledge
    • #Scepticism
  • #Ethics

    • #Pleasure
    • #Pain
    • #Engagement
    • #EpicureanLiving
    • #Happiness
    • #Virtue
      • #Wisdom
      • #Temperance
      • #Courage
      • #Justice
      • #Honesty
      • #Faith (Confidence)
      • #Suavity
      • #Consideration
      • #Hope
      • #Gratitude
      • #Friendship



Click Here To Search All Tags

To Suggest Additions To This List Click Here

EpicureanFriends - Classical Epicurean Philosophy

  1. Home
    1. About Us
    2. Classical Epicurean Philosophy
  2. Wiki
    1. Getting Started
  3. Frequently Asked Questions
    1. Site Map
  4. Forum
    1. Latest Threads
    2. Featured Threads
    3. Unread Posts
  5. Texts
    1. Core Texts
    2. Biography of Epicurus
    3. Lucretius
  6. Articles
    1. Latest Articles
  7. Gallery
    1. Featured Images
  8. Calendar
    1. This Month At EpicureanFriends
Powered by WoltLab Suite™ 6.0.22
Style: Inspire by cls-design
Stylename
Inspire
Manufacturer
cls-design
Licence
Commercial styles
Help
Supportforum
Visit cls-design