1. New
    1. Member Announcements
  2. Home
    1. Get Started - Activities
    2. Posting Policies
    3. Community Standards
    4. Terms of Use
    5. Moderator Team
    6. Site Map
    7. Quizzes
    8. Articles
      1. Featured Articles
      2. Blog Posts at EpicureanFriends
  3. Wiki
    1. Wiki Home
    2. FAQ
    3. Classical Epicureanism
    4. Physics
    5. Canonics
    6. Ethics
    7. Search Assistance
    8. Not NeoEpicurean
    9. Foundations
    10. Navigation Outlines
    11. Key Pages
  4. Forum
    1. New Activity
    2. New Threads
    3. Welcome
    4. General Discussion
    5. Featured
    6. Activism
    7. Shortcuts
    8. Dashboard
    9. Full Forum List
    10. Level 3+
    11. Most Discussed
  5. Podcast
    1. Lucretius Today Podcast
    2. Episode Guide
    3. Lucretius Today At Youtube
    4. EpicureanFriends Youtube Page
  6. Texts
    1. Overview
    2. Diogenes Laertius
    3. Principal Doctrines
    4. Vatican Sayings
    5. Lucretius
    6. Herodotus
    7. Pythocles
    8. Menoeceus
    9. Fragments - Usener Collection
    10. Torquatus On Ethics
    11. Velleius On Gods
    12. Greek/Latin Help
  7. Gallery
    1. Featured images
    2. Albums
    3. Latest Images
    4. Latest Comments
  8. Calendar
    1. Upcoming Events List
    2. Zoom Meetings
    3. This Month
    4. First Monday Zoom Meetings
    5. Wednesday Zoom Meeting
    6. Twentieth Zoom Meetings
    7. Zoom Meetings
  9. Other
    1. Featured Content
    2. Blog Posts
    3. Files
    4. Logbook
    5. EF ToDo List
    6. Link-Database
  • Login
  • Register
  • Search
This Thread
  • Everywhere
  • This Thread
  • This Forum
  • Forum
  • Articles
  • Blog Articles
  • Files
  • Gallery
  • Events
  • Pages
  • Wiki
  • Help
  • FAQ
  • More Options

Welcome To EpicureanFriends.com!

"Remember that you are mortal, and you have a limited time to live, and in devoting yourself to discussion of the nature of time and eternity you have seen things that have been, are now, and are to come."

Sign In Now
or
Register a new account
  1. New
    1. Member Announcements
  2. Home
    1. Get Started - Activities
    2. Posting Policies
    3. Community Standards
    4. Terms of Use
    5. Moderator Team
    6. Site Map
    7. Quizzes
    8. Articles
      1. Featured Articles
      2. Blog Posts at EpicureanFriends
  3. Wiki
    1. Wiki Home
    2. FAQ
    3. Classical Epicureanism
    4. Physics
    5. Canonics
    6. Ethics
    7. Search Assistance
    8. Not NeoEpicurean
    9. Foundations
    10. Navigation Outlines
    11. Key Pages
  4. Forum
    1. New Activity
    2. New Threads
    3. Welcome
    4. General Discussion
    5. Featured
    6. Activism
    7. Shortcuts
    8. Dashboard
    9. Full Forum List
    10. Level 3+
    11. Most Discussed
  5. Podcast
    1. Lucretius Today Podcast
    2. Episode Guide
    3. Lucretius Today At Youtube
    4. EpicureanFriends Youtube Page
  6. Texts
    1. Overview
    2. Diogenes Laertius
    3. Principal Doctrines
    4. Vatican Sayings
    5. Lucretius
    6. Herodotus
    7. Pythocles
    8. Menoeceus
    9. Fragments - Usener Collection
    10. Torquatus On Ethics
    11. Velleius On Gods
    12. Greek/Latin Help
  7. Gallery
    1. Featured images
    2. Albums
    3. Latest Images
    4. Latest Comments
  8. Calendar
    1. Upcoming Events List
    2. Zoom Meetings
    3. This Month
    4. First Monday Zoom Meetings
    5. Wednesday Zoom Meeting
    6. Twentieth Zoom Meetings
    7. Zoom Meetings
  9. Other
    1. Featured Content
    2. Blog Posts
    3. Files
    4. Logbook
    5. EF ToDo List
    6. Link-Database
  1. New
    1. Member Announcements
  2. Home
    1. Get Started - Activities
    2. Posting Policies
    3. Community Standards
    4. Terms of Use
    5. Moderator Team
    6. Site Map
    7. Quizzes
    8. Articles
      1. Featured Articles
      2. Blog Posts at EpicureanFriends
  3. Wiki
    1. Wiki Home
    2. FAQ
    3. Classical Epicureanism
    4. Physics
    5. Canonics
    6. Ethics
    7. Search Assistance
    8. Not NeoEpicurean
    9. Foundations
    10. Navigation Outlines
    11. Key Pages
  4. Forum
    1. New Activity
    2. New Threads
    3. Welcome
    4. General Discussion
    5. Featured
    6. Activism
    7. Shortcuts
    8. Dashboard
    9. Full Forum List
    10. Level 3+
    11. Most Discussed
  5. Podcast
    1. Lucretius Today Podcast
    2. Episode Guide
    3. Lucretius Today At Youtube
    4. EpicureanFriends Youtube Page
  6. Texts
    1. Overview
    2. Diogenes Laertius
    3. Principal Doctrines
    4. Vatican Sayings
    5. Lucretius
    6. Herodotus
    7. Pythocles
    8. Menoeceus
    9. Fragments - Usener Collection
    10. Torquatus On Ethics
    11. Velleius On Gods
    12. Greek/Latin Help
  7. Gallery
    1. Featured images
    2. Albums
    3. Latest Images
    4. Latest Comments
  8. Calendar
    1. Upcoming Events List
    2. Zoom Meetings
    3. This Month
    4. First Monday Zoom Meetings
    5. Wednesday Zoom Meeting
    6. Twentieth Zoom Meetings
    7. Zoom Meetings
  9. Other
    1. Featured Content
    2. Blog Posts
    3. Files
    4. Logbook
    5. EF ToDo List
    6. Link-Database
  1. EpicureanFriends - Home of Classical Epicurean Philosophy
  2. Forum
  3. Epicurean Texts
  4. Other Collections - "The Suda" and "The Greek Anthology"
  5. "The Greek Anthology"
  • Sidebar
  • Sidebar

Epigrams on Atomism

  • Joshua
  • December 10, 2020 at 9:33 PM
  • Go to last post
Regularly Checking In On A Small Screen Device? Bookmark THIS page!
  • Online
    Joshua
    05 - Administrator
    Points
    14,850
    Posts
    1,882
    Quizzes
    3
    Quiz rate
    95.8 %
    • December 10, 2020 at 9:33 PM
    • #1

    Book XI - Convivial and Satirical Epigrams

    No. 50 - Automedon

    Quote

    "Blest is he first who owes naught to anyone, next he who never married, and thirdly he who is childless. But if a man be mad enough to marry, it is a blessing for him if he buries his wife at once after getting a handsome dowry. Knowing this, be wise, and leave Epicurus to enquire in vain where is the void and what are the atoms."

    Translated W. R. Paton

  • Online
    Joshua
    05 - Administrator
    Points
    14,850
    Posts
    1,882
    Quizzes
    3
    Quiz rate
    95.8 %
    • December 10, 2020 at 9:40 PM
    • #2

    Book XI - Convivial and Satirical Epigrams

    No. 93 - Lucilius

    Quote

    "Lean Marcus once made a hole with his head in one of Epicurus' atoms and went through the middle of it."

    Translated W. R. Paton

  • Online
    Joshua
    05 - Administrator
    Points
    14,850
    Posts
    1,882
    Quizzes
    3
    Quiz rate
    95.8 %
    • December 10, 2020 at 9:48 PM
    • #3

    Book XI - Convivial and Satirical Epigrams

    No. 103 - Lucilius

    Quote

    Epicurus wrote that all the world consisted of atoms, thinking, Alcimus, that an atom was the most minute thing. But if Diophantus had existed then he would have written that it consisted of Diophantus, who is much more minute than the atoms. Or he would have written that other things were composed of atoms, but the atoms themselves, Alcimus, of Diophantus.

    Translated W. R. Paton

  • Online
    Joshua
    05 - Administrator
    Points
    14,850
    Posts
    1,882
    Quizzes
    3
    Quiz rate
    95.8 %
    • December 10, 2020 at 9:59 PM
    • #4

    Book XI - Convivial and Satirical Epigrams

    No. 249 - Lucilius

    Quote

    "Menophanes bought a field, and from hunger hanged himself on another man's oak. When he was dead they had no earth to throw over him from above, but he was buried for payment in the ground of one of his neighbors. If Epicurus had known of Menophanes' field he would have said that everything is full of fields, not of atoms."

    Translated W. R. Paton

  • Online
    Cassius
    05 - Administrator
    Points
    101,842
    Posts
    13,943
    Quizzes
    9
    Quiz rate
    100.0 %
    • December 10, 2020 at 11:15 PM
    • #5

    Those are wild but I am not sure at all to make out of Book 10 number 249

  • Online
    Joshua
    05 - Administrator
    Points
    14,850
    Posts
    1,882
    Quizzes
    3
    Quiz rate
    95.8 %
    • December 10, 2020 at 11:30 PM
    • #6

    Apart from being merely ironic and satirical, I can think of one fact in connection with Menophanes' proverbially tiny field. The Ancient Greeks did not use primogeniture where the eldest son is awarded the estate. Instead they divided the land among all of the heirs. As the generations went by, each parcel was subdivided again and again with every successive death in the family, until they became so small as to be entirely unusable. The Greek solution to this problem was to pack a bunch of smallholders onto a ship and send them off to start a colony on empty land somewhere.

    This was, in fact, the fate of Neocles and his family. Neocles was born in Gargettos seven miles outside of Athens, but was sent to the island of Samos where a colony was founded.

    But I wouldn't read too much into any of these! Lucilius has dozens like these two, where he satirizes people's stature and appearance.

  • Don
    ΕΠΙΚΟΥΡΕΙΟΣ (Epicurist)
    Points
    39,481
    Posts
    5,505
    Quizzes
    9
    Quiz rate
    92.8 %
    • December 11, 2020 at 10:52 AM
    • #7
    Quote from JJElbert

    Book XI - Convivial and Satirical Epigrams

    No. 50 - Automedon

    Quote

    "Blest is he first who owes naught to anyone, next he who never married, and thirdly he who is childless. But if a man be mad enough to marry, it is a blessing for him if he buries his wife at once after getting a handsome dowry. Knowing this, be wise, and leave Epicurus to enquire in vain where is the void and what are the atoms."

    Translated W. R. Paton

    Display More

    While I don't endorse the overall sentiment in any way (for the record), I find it interesting that "blest" is used to translate the first word Ευδαίμων Eudaimōn (i.e., Eudaimonia).

  • Online
    Joshua
    05 - Administrator
    Points
    14,850
    Posts
    1,882
    Quizzes
    3
    Quiz rate
    95.8 %
    • December 11, 2020 at 1:00 PM
    • #8
    Quote

    While I don't endorse the overall sentiment in any way

    Ha! Certainly not. A lot of these epigrammatists were very sour. I'll start posting Palladas next week. He has a few good ones but most of his are even worse than this.

  • Online
    Joshua
    05 - Administrator
    Points
    14,850
    Posts
    1,882
    Quizzes
    3
    Quiz rate
    95.8 %
    • December 11, 2020 at 1:31 PM
    • #9

    Also for the record, by the words "enquire in vain" I'm inferring that Automedon was being dismissive of Epicurus and his philosophy.

  • Online
    Cassius
    05 - Administrator
    Points
    101,842
    Posts
    13,943
    Quizzes
    9
    Quiz rate
    100.0 %
    • December 11, 2020 at 4:22 PM
    • #10

    Yes it seems like the majority of these are anti Epicurean but that does not mean they aren't valuable. Maybe we need a warning in the first post or the thread

Unread Threads

    1. Title
    2. Replies
    3. Last Reply
    1. ⟐ as the symbol of the philosophy of Epicurus 65

      • Like 2
      • michelepinto
      • March 18, 2021 at 11:59 AM
      • General Discussion
      • michelepinto
      • May 20, 2025 at 9:40 AM
    2. Replies
      65
      Views
      8.8k
      65
    3. Kalosyni

      May 20, 2025 at 9:40 AM
    1. Analysing movies through an Epicurean lens 16

      • Like 1
      • Rolf
      • May 12, 2025 at 4:54 PM
      • General Discussion
      • Rolf
      • May 19, 2025 at 12:45 AM
    2. Replies
      16
      Views
      876
      16
    3. Matteng

      May 19, 2025 at 12:45 AM
    1. "All Models Are Wrong, But Some Are Useful" 4

      • Like 2
      • Cassius
      • January 21, 2024 at 11:21 AM
      • General Discussion
      • Cassius
      • May 14, 2025 at 1:49 PM
    2. Replies
      4
      Views
      1.3k
      4
    3. kochiekoch

      May 14, 2025 at 1:49 PM
    1. Is All Desire Painful? How Would Epicurus Answer? 24

      • Like 1
      • Cassius
      • May 7, 2025 at 10:02 PM
      • General Discussion
      • Cassius
      • May 10, 2025 at 3:42 PM
    2. Replies
      24
      Views
      1.2k
      24
    3. sanantoniogarden

      May 10, 2025 at 3:42 PM
    1. Pompeii Then and Now 7

      • Like 2
      • kochiekoch
      • January 22, 2025 at 1:19 PM
      • General Discussion
      • kochiekoch
      • May 8, 2025 at 3:50 PM
    2. Replies
      7
      Views
      1.2k
      7
    3. kochiekoch

      May 8, 2025 at 3:50 PM

Latest Posts

  • Article: Scientists in a race to discover why our Universe exists

    Kalosyni May 20, 2025 at 10:30 AM
  • ⟐ as the symbol of the philosophy of Epicurus

    Kalosyni May 20, 2025 at 9:40 AM
  • Happy Twentieth of May 2025!

    Cassius May 20, 2025 at 9:05 AM
  • Episode 281 - Is Pain The Greatest Evil - Or Even An Evil At All? - Part One - Not Yet Recorded

    Eikadistes May 19, 2025 at 6:17 PM
  • New "TWENTIERS" Website

    Cassius May 19, 2025 at 4:30 PM
  • Sabine Hossenfelder - Why the Multiverse Is Religion

    Eikadistes May 19, 2025 at 3:39 PM
  • What Makes Someone "An Epicurean?"

    Eikadistes May 19, 2025 at 1:06 PM
  • Analysing movies through an Epicurean lens

    Matteng May 19, 2025 at 12:45 AM
  • Personal mottos?

    Kalosyni May 18, 2025 at 9:22 AM
  • The Garland of Tranquility and a Reposed Life

    Kalosyni May 18, 2025 at 9:07 AM

EpicureanFriends - Classical Epicurean Philosophy

  1. Home
    1. About Us
    2. Classical Epicurean Philosophy
  2. Wiki
    1. Getting Started
  3. Frequently Asked Questions
    1. Site Map
  4. Forum
    1. Latest Threads
    2. Featured Threads
    3. Unread Posts
  5. Texts
    1. Core Texts
    2. Biography of Epicurus
    3. Lucretius
  6. Articles
    1. Latest Articles
  7. Gallery
    1. Featured Images
  8. Calendar
    1. This Month At EpicureanFriends
Powered by WoltLab Suite™ 6.0.22
Style: Inspire by cls-design
Stylename
Inspire
Manufacturer
cls-design
Licence
Commercial styles
Help
Supportforum
Visit cls-design