The Letter to Menoeceus - Translation By Cyril Bailey

    Quote from camotero
    Quote from Nate

    ceaselessly satisfied being

    This makes much more sense than inmortal being. Could this be a mis interpretation of the greek word too? What was it?

    Epicurus: τὸν θεὸν ζῷον ἄφθαρτον καὶ μακάριον

    A god is a ἄφθαρτον and μακάριον being (or image depending how you interpret
    ζῷον)


    ἄφθαρτον = incorruptible, undying, eternal, uncorrupted

    μακάριον = blessed, completely happy, etc

    Quote from Don

    Epicurus: τὸν θεὸν ζῷον ἄφθαρτον καὶ μακάριον


    A god is a ἄφθαρτον and μακάριον being (or image depending how you interpret
    ζῷον)

    Does "kai" only translate to "and"?

    How do you get from that to "ceaselessly satisfied " @Nate ?

    It would be awesome to know there's a meaning of kai that allows for "incorruptible blessedness" 🤪

    Honestly, I'm still in the Sedley idealist camp since, to my mind, the only way something could be ἄφθαρτον is if it is a mental construction, something in our imagination to who we stream images of a being who is experiencing an eternally pleasurable state of being. I admit I need to read more and meditate on these things, because Epicurus placed a great deal of importance on this.

    Quote from Cassius

    For it is better in a man’s actions that what is well chosen (should fail, rather than that what is ill chosen) should be successful owing to chance.

    Quote from Epicurus Reader

    For it is better for a good decision not to turn out right in action than for a bad decision to turn out right because of chance.

    It seems clear that a right (successful) or bad (failing) result of our decisions would be related to whether or not it resulted in pleasure/pain... right?

    But... What is a good (well) or bad (ill) choice/decision in the first place? One made using our senses and feelings?

    Anyone thinks of a didactic example?

    Camotero I think what you are questioning is the issue of the canon -- what it is, how to use it, etc. So simply saying "using our senses and feelings" is a start, but not the whole. You would need to incorporate all three of the legs of the canon, and then consider the rules of comparison and analogy (rather than abstract logical reasoning) of which we only have fragments of the full description.

    If you decide to read further into that, I recommend the long appendix, and then the text, of the DeLacy translation of Philodemus' "On Signs" or "On Methods of Inference" (same work; different title).

    I think what Epicurus is saying is that for the most success in life we need to tune our functioning to understanding Epicurean philosophy and how to apply it. No doubt we can feel relieved if something turns out pleasurable as a result of a decision made in an improper way, but I think he is saying that if we indulge that method consciously and regularly we are bound to suffer for it not because there is fate, but because we succeed best when we worth "with" the nature of things and not "against" it or in ignorance of it.

Finding Things At EpicureanFriends.com

Here is a list of suggested search strategies:

  • Website Overview page - clickable links arrranged by cards.
  • Forum Main Page - list of forums and subforums arranged by topic. Threads are posted according to relevant topics. The "Uncategorized subforum" contains threads which do not fall into any existing topic (also contains older "unfiled" threads which will soon be moved).
  • Search Tool - icon is located on the top right of every page. Note that the search box asks you what section of the forum you'd like to search. If you don't know, select "Everywhere."
  • Search By Key Tags - curated to show frequently-searched topics.
  • Full Tag List - an alphabetical list of all tags.