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Cassius
June 5, 2026 at 3:42 PM Replied to the thread Discussion of Blog Article: "Living For Pleasure, Or Dying For Relief From Pain?".Post[…]
Thanks for your comments. I don't think that is a straw man argument at all. It is exactly this part of what Epicurus says - that we DO sometimes choose pain to maximize pleasure - that is in issue.
I wouldn't normally think it necessary to point… -
Todd
June 5, 2026 at 2:50 PM Replied to the thread Discussion of Blog Article: "Living For Pleasure, Or Dying For Relief From Pain?".PostSome minor feedback:
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This is a straw man argument. Such a person would certainly choose a lesser pain as a means of avoiding a greater one.
[…]
"pursued nature"
I think that should be "studied nature"
"fear...of what the neighbors will think"
While… -
Cassius
ThreadJune 5, 2026 at 1:38 PM This thread is for discussion of the blog article "Living For Pleasure, Or Dying For Relief From Pain?"
epicureanfriends.com/wcf/blog/entry/78/ -
Cassius
June 5, 2026 at 1:35 PM Wrote the blog article Living For Pleasure, Or Dying For Relief From Pain?.Blog Article[…]Is The "Emphasis" In Epicurean Philosophy On Relief From Pain?
In a separate article I have made the case that it is a major rhetorical and factual mistake to describe Epicurean philosophy as primarily about relief from pain. Jack Gedney, a writer on… -
Titus
June 5, 2026 at 12:59 PM Replied to the thread A. Le Grand's Divine Epicurus.Post[…]
At least this insight is truly Epicurean (last maxims of the Principal Doctrines ). The book shows this to us indirectly, at least hundreds of years later. -
Pacatus
June 5, 2026 at 11:54 AM Replied to the thread A. Le Grand's Divine Epicurus.Post[…]
It is fun to read the cadences and phrasing of that 17th century English, as well as the contents.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Early_Modern_English -
Cassius
June 5, 2026 at 7:36 AM Replied to the thread A. Le Grand's Divine Epicurus.PostAs a reminder of what it means to be Cartesian, which Wikipedia emphasizes LeGrande was, there's this from Wikipedia:
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Cassius
June 5, 2026 at 7:22 AM Replied to the thread A. Le Grand's Divine Epicurus.PostI agree Tau Phi.
And thank you again. This is a major contribution here. We have to take the bad along with the good and process it all. -
TauPhi
June 5, 2026 at 7:05 AM Replied to the thread A. Le Grand's Divine Epicurus.PostYour comments about the book sum it up pretty accurately, Cassius . This is not a resource that can be reliably used in a study of Epicurean philosophy by any stretch of imagination. The book is archaic not only in language but the contents as well. I… -
Cassius
June 5, 2026 at 7:01 AM Replied to the thread A. Le Grand's Divine Epicurus.PostMy verdict is that this book is an abomination, but a highly useful one.
It might deserve the award of being the first "truly modern" book on Epicurus that has led the way toward the numerous watered-down versions of Epicurean philosophy that we have… -
Cassius
June 5, 2026 at 6:27 AM Replied to the thread A. Le Grand's Divine Epicurus.PostI would suggest that a representative sample of the Christianization of this work is the "Third Discourse" on Celibacy starting on page 45 of the PDF. Yes indeed this represents a species of modern Epicureanism, but i can't imagine Epicurus taking… -
Cassius
June 5, 2026 at 6:15 AM Replied to the thread A. Le Grand's Divine Epicurus.PostThe file section thread is linked below.
As part of his Wikipedia biography I see that LeGrande was highly religious and (sarcasm) a real prince of a guy:
[…]
I'm getting a highly negative impression of LeGrande and this work but let me emphasize that I am… -
Cassius
June 5, 2026 at 6:03 AM Added the file LeGrande - The Divine Epicurus.FileI'll come back and add more description when a more clear picture emerges of what it really represents. At present I'd call it a Gassendi-like treatment of Epicurean ethics which attempts to blend in a lot of Christian / Conventional morailty and argue… -
Cassius
June 5, 2026 at 5:59 AM Replied to the thread A. Le Grand's Divine Epicurus.PostI have scanned over about 50% so far. Couple of comments:- I am not able to get the link in Don's original post to work anymore. Not sure what's up with that.
- It's difficult to read because of its archaic constructions and flowery language, much worse
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Bryan
June 5, 2026 at 1:37 AM Replied to the thread A. Le Grand's Divine Epicurus.PostYes, thank you! This is new to me.. but, now that it is actually accessible, hopefully we all can dig in! -
Bryan
June 5, 2026 at 12:33 AM Replied to the thread Bryan Harris Interlinear Translation Of Lucretius.PostThe section titles in the text are unlikely to have been placed by Lucretius, but are ancient·
The three manuscripts that De Rerum Natura is based on are Codex Oblongus (from the early 800s CE), Codex Quadratus (from the mid-800s CE), and the partial … -
Don
June 4, 2026 at 10:32 PM Replied to the thread Suavity - General Discussion.PostDefinitions from the Oxford English Dictionary
SUAVITY
Meaning & use
1.†
1.a.c1450–1661 Sweetness or agreeableness to the senses; esp. sweetness (of taste), fragrance (of odour). Obsolete.
1.b.1614–1821 † Sweetness (of sound, harmony, expression).
2.a.1594–… -
Cassius
June 4, 2026 at 9:31 PM Replied to the thread A. Le Grand's Divine Epicurus.PostThank you Tau Phi! -
TauPhi
June 4, 2026 at 9:20 PM Replied to the thread A. Le Grand's Divine Epicurus.PostI'm sorry to resurrect this thread after 5 years of inactivity, but if anyone's interested in this 350 years old book, I've restored it and prepared a modern PDF version.
The original book contains around 50 marginalia, mostly in Latin. I've moved these… -
Pacatus
June 4, 2026 at 11:42 AM Replied to the thread Suavity - General Discussion.PostI recall Hiram Crespo also using the word suavity in his book (Tending the Epicurean Garden). -
Cassius
June 4, 2026 at 11:26 AM Replied to the thread Suavity - General Discussion.PostAlso the word "unctuous" comes to mind.
I can think of numbers of people who will remain unnamed who have that kind of sickly-sweet demeanor.
On the other hand (despite it being my least favorite part of her book) Frances Wright spends her Chapter One… -
Cassius
June 4, 2026 at 10:26 AM Replied to the thread Suavity - General Discussion.PostSince suavity appears to be more Latin than Greek we probably need to look more to the Latin use of it.
[…]
I suspect that this is a very bad thing for the culture if even Don finds the word to be highly suspicious (as I do myself).
Certainly the times have… -
Don
June 4, 2026 at 8:46 AM Replied to the thread Suavity - General Discussion.PostI freely admit I have no grasp on what "suavity" means, and I didn't think DeWitt adds anything to explain it. He just assumes I know what it means and keeps using it.
Being suave or having suavity didn't seem all that positive from what I was seeing in… -
Cassius
June 4, 2026 at 4:05 AM Replied to the thread Happy Birthday General Thread.PostHappy Birthday to Cornelius Peripateticus! Learn more about Cornelius Peripateticus and say happy birthday on Cornelius Peripateticus's timeline: Cornelius Peripateticus -
Cassius
June 4, 2026 at 4:05 AM Replied to the thread Happy Birthday General Thread.PostHappy Birthday to illuminati24! Learn more about illuminati24 and say happy birthday on illuminati24's timeline: illuminati24 -
Bryan
June 4, 2026 at 1:12 AM Replied to the thread Suavity - General Discussion.PostI think Dewitt was focusing on ἡ χάρις (grace) for this.... and even here the alpha privative (i.e., ungrateful) shows itself to be important to Epicurus' thought.
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Cassius
June 3, 2026 at 9:17 PM Posted the thread Suavity - General Discussion.ThreadTonight we discussed briefly on the forum that just as there was an emphasis on "frank Speech" there was also an Epicurean emphasis on "Suavity" - at least according to the sources collected below by DeWitt. Given the hazards that "frank speech" can… -
Don
June 3, 2026 at 7:51 PM Replied to the thread Eudaimonia and Makariotēs in the Letter to Menoeceus.Post[…]
Nicely worded! Yes.
(LOL I'm sure Plato and Aristotle would beg to differ, but I don't think that have a leg to stand on with their arguments) -
Pacatus
June 3, 2026 at 5:49 PM Replied to the thread Eudaimonia and Makariotēs in the Letter to Menoeceus.PostYes, unlike, say Plato or Aristotle, Epicurus’ ethics are derived from a proper understanding of nature. I might put it thus:
Φῠ́σῐς (φῠσῐολογίᾱ) ⇒ συμπερασματολογία [?] (logical inference*) ⇒ ἠθῐκός (ethics).
Nature as a whole (and our place in it) is the… -
Don
June 3, 2026 at 2:59 PM Replied to the thread Eudaimonia and Makariotēs in the Letter to Menoeceus.Post[…]
Touché. Good point. And physics is the study of nature. However, physics was a fundamental component of philosophy for everyone. From Diogenes Laertius' Lives 1:18:
Philosophy has three parts, physics, ethics, and dialectic or logic. Physics is the…
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