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  1. EpicureanFriends - Home of Classical Epicurean Philosophy
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Posts by Cassius

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  • On The Question: "How Long Should We Desire To Live?"

    • Cassius
    • April 18, 2021 at 2:38 PM

    You're quite possibly right in this instance, but I am afraid I have a significant sequence of Bailey choices that have convinced me to be suspicious :)

    But rather than be negative let me focus on the positive: I continue to be fascinated that the older, unknown Daniel Browne translator frequently strikes me as best. And he's not that far in time from the Creech translation that I find to be almost unusable. So there's something fascinating to me about that 1743 version.

  • On The Question: "How Long Should We Desire To Live?"

    • Cassius
    • April 18, 2021 at 8:30 AM

    Lucretius Book Five:

    Brown 1743: "Indeed, when we are once born, we should strive (whoever he be) to preserve our life, so long as we find an engaging pleasure in our being...."

    Munro 1886: "Whoever has been born must want to continue in life, so long as fond pleasure shall keep him...."

    Bailey 1921: "For whosoever has been born must needs wish to abide in life, so long as enticing pleasure shall hold him."

    My comment:

    Once again I find the 1743 edition more in tune with what I think the meaning should be if viewed in accord with the sweep of the philosophy ("engaging" is a positive word).

    Munro's "keep" probably will strike some as odd language but it's probably accurate if we look back to older usages of keep (I remember the hymn phrase "The Lord bless you and keep you...." which does not seem to have a negative connotation).

    But Bailey's "hold" has almost a Buddhist sound to it and I would accordingly reject that implication as negative. I would probably add this to my personal list of examples from Bailey where his choice of words reflects poorly on his assessment of Epicurean philosophy.

    Does pleasure "hold" us, or does it provide the very goal and reason for living? If Bailey agreed personally with the latter option I don't think he would have used the word "hold" - if he didn't like "engage" and wanted to follow Munro's direction then "keep" or even "sustain" would have been a better choice.

  • How Emotions Are Made: The Secret Life of the Brain by Lisa Feldman Barrett

    • Cassius
    • April 17, 2021 at 8:09 PM

    Yeah I thought about not using the "rabble" word but I couldn't remember the "hoi polloi"! Actually neither term fits my target, because I don't mean to say anything demeaning about those who innocently misconstrue. My focus is on the strictly philosophical debate i referenced earlier, in with "pleasure" is the more technical term and "living pleasurably" is the more colloquial description. (I was thinking there was a passage about "the crowd" but couldn't put my finger on it.)

  • Social Media - Discord

    • Cassius
    • April 17, 2021 at 7:01 PM

    The EpicureanFriends server at Discord is located here. At Discord Cassius Amicus's user name is Cassius Amicus#7026

  • Social Media - Fediverse

    • Cassius
    • April 17, 2021 at 6:21 PM

    Cassius Amicus account accessible through the Fediverse, which is an open source open standards platform designed to provide an alternative to such closed corporate services as Twitter and Facebook. As a member of the Fediverse, the Cassius Amicus account can be followed by many Mastodon web and mobile applications, especially including Fedilab.

    Edit: As of 11/20/22 the Fediverse address is https://social.vivaldi.net/@cassiusamicus

  • The Gallery Feature Here At EpicureanFriends.com

    • Cassius
    • April 17, 2021 at 4:28 PM

    Possibly one of the best sources for Epicurean philosophy "memes" and other Epicurean philosophy graphics to share on social media is here in our "Gallery."

    Access the gallery here: https://www.epicureanfriends.com/wcf/gallery/

    The gallery is organized by Category here: https://www.epicureanfriends.com/wcf/gallery/index.php?album-list/

  • How Emotions Are Made: The Secret Life of the Brain by Lisa Feldman Barrett

    • Cassius
    • April 17, 2021 at 4:17 PM
    Quote from Godfrey

    The affective circumplex

    OK we're going to need some definitions soon!

    Quote from Don

    may try to use the single word "pleasure" to mischaracterize the philosophy as Cyrenaic hedonism.

    What is this "may" stuff? Two thousand years of it and you can bet your life the misrepresentation / confusion will last another two thousand years too! I'm afraid this is something we just have to live with and do our best to avoid, but not by watering down the true philosophy. ;)

    Quote

    When, therefore, we maintain that pleasure is the end, we do not mean the pleasures of profligates and those that consist in sensuality, as is supposed by some who are either ignorant or disagree with us or do not understand,

    More seriously you are of course right, but the issue that takes precedence (at least in my mind, and in many circumstances) is that clarity and the benefit of ourselves and our friends trumps everything else, regardless of what the "rabble" choose to believe! ;)

    Quote

    VS 29. For I would certainly prefer, as I study Nature, to announce frankly what is beneficial to all people, even if none agrees with me, rather than to compromise with common opinions, and thus reap the frequent praise of the many.

  • Was There For Socrates a Particular Greek God of Reason / Rationality / Or Specifically "Wisdom"?

    • Cassius
    • April 17, 2021 at 2:02 PM

    Thank you Elli!

  • How Emotions Are Made: The Secret Life of the Brain by Lisa Feldman Barrett

    • Cassius
    • April 17, 2021 at 12:15 PM
    Quote from Don

    nothing inherently inconsistent with Epicurus's philosophy to wanting to have a calm mind and a pain free body.

    Absolutely agreed that there is nothing inconsistent about that, the issue would be that of being strictly rigorous in identifying the goal - the "end of nature," rather than getting sidetracked on lesser issues that are only part of the goal, like some people tend to do when they focus on the means rather than the end.

    As for the distinction between "living pleasurably" and "pleasure" I think that the issue revolves around the context in which you're discussing the issue. If you're in a strictly philosophic debate you reduce things down to as essential and clear a concept as possible, so you end up expressing it like Torquatus did with his formulation:

    Quote

    I will start then in the manner approved by the author of the system himself, by settling what are the essence and qualities of the thing that is the object of our inquiry; not that I suppose you to be ignorant of it, but because this is the logical method of procedure. We are inquiring, then, what is the final and ultimate Good, which as all philosophers are agreed must be of such a nature as to be the End to which all other things are means, while it is not itself a means to anything else. This Epicurus finds in pleasure; pleasure he holds to be the Chief Good, pain the Chief Evil.

    When we start talking about "living pleasurably" we're getting in the details of exactly what pleasures we're pursuing in a particular moment. When we talk about "pleasure" it sounds like we're at that higher level of identifying our ultimate goal (such as "virtue" vs "piety" vs "reason" vs "wisdom" vs "pleasure")

    Both perspectives are valid and should not be seen to be at war with each other, or that one needs to replace the other.

  • Websites: EpicSwerve.com

    • Cassius
    • April 17, 2021 at 10:47 AM

    The EpicSwerve website is here, and discussion with its author is here.

  • Social Media - Instant Messaging (Telegram, Matrix, Threema)

    • Cassius
    • April 17, 2021 at 10:42 AM

    EpicureanFriends account at Matrix.org

    Update 2-6-22: This account is still there, but I am not signing in very often. I have cooled off toward Matrix for a variety of reasons, mainly that they too seem to be getting a lot of mysterious funding that no doubt has strings attached. They are open source and the security may be there if you run your own server, but at this point they don't make it easy to do that and so using the matrix.org main server probably subjects you to unwanted vulnerabilities.

  • Social Media - PixelFed

    • Cassius
    • April 17, 2021 at 10:40 AM

    Cassius Amicus account at Pixelfed.

  • Social Media - Odysee

    • Cassius
    • April 17, 2021 at 10:31 AM

    The Odysee (formerly Lbry.tv) account for Cassius Amicus is here.

  • Social Media - Youtube

    • Cassius
    • April 17, 2021 at 10:27 AM

    Cassius Amicus / NewEpicurean account at Youtube

  • Social Media - Instagram

    • Cassius
    • April 17, 2021 at 10:24 AM

    Cassius Amicus at Instragram

  • Social Media - Gab

    • Cassius
    • April 17, 2021 at 10:14 AM

    The Cassius Amicus page at Gab.com (established long ago but not regularly used) is here.

  • Social Media - Minds

    • Cassius
    • April 17, 2021 at 10:13 AM

    The Cassius Amicus page at Minds.com (established long ago but not regularly used) is here.

  • Social Media - Twitter

    • Cassius
    • April 17, 2021 at 10:10 AM

    The NewEpicurean twitter feed is here.

    The Society of Epicurus twitter feed is here.

  • Social Media - Reddit

    • Cassius
    • April 17, 2021 at 10:09 AM

    The primary Reddit thread on Epicurean philosophy is here.

  • Social Media - Facebook

    • Cassius
    • April 17, 2021 at 10:08 AM

    The primary Epicurean Philosophy Facebook group is here.

    The largest Epicurus "page" is here.

Unread Threads

    1. Title
    2. Replies
    3. Last Reply
    1. Philodemus' "On Anger" - General - Texts and Resources 20

      • Like 1
      • Cassius
      • April 1, 2022 at 5:36 PM
      • Philodemus On Anger
      • Cassius
      • July 8, 2025 at 7:33 AM
    2. Replies
      20
      Views
      6.9k
      20
    3. Kalosyni

      July 8, 2025 at 7:33 AM
    1. Mocking Epithets 3

      • Like 3
      • Bryan
      • July 4, 2025 at 3:01 PM
      • Comparing Epicurus With Other Philosophers - General Discussion
      • Bryan
      • July 6, 2025 at 9:47 PM
    2. Replies
      3
      Views
      422
      3
    3. Bryan

      July 6, 2025 at 9:47 PM
    1. Best Lucretius translation? 12

      • Like 1
      • Rolf
      • June 19, 2025 at 8:40 AM
      • General Discussion of "On The Nature of Things"
      • Rolf
      • July 1, 2025 at 1:59 PM
    2. Replies
      12
      Views
      1.1k
      12
    3. Eikadistes

      July 1, 2025 at 1:59 PM
    1. The Religion of Nature - as supported by Lucretius' De Rerum Natura 4

      • Thanks 1
      • Kalosyni
      • June 12, 2025 at 12:03 PM
      • General Discussion of "On The Nature of Things"
      • Kalosyni
      • June 23, 2025 at 12:36 AM
    2. Replies
      4
      Views
      954
      4
    3. Godfrey

      June 23, 2025 at 12:36 AM
    1. New Blog Post From Elli - " Fanaticism and the Danger of Dogmatism in Political and Religious Thought: An Epicurean Reading"

      • Like 3
      • Cassius
      • June 20, 2025 at 4:31 PM
      • Epicurus vs Abraham (Judaism, Christianity, Islam)
      • Cassius
      • June 20, 2025 at 4:31 PM
    2. Replies
      0
      Views
      2.5k

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Latest Posts

  • Preuss - "Epicurean Ethics - Katastematic Hedonism"

    Kalosyni July 15, 2025 at 4:38 AM
  • Perspectives On "Proving" That Pleasure is "The Good"

    DistantLaughter July 15, 2025 at 4:21 AM
  • Epicurus' Prolepsis vs Heraclitus' Flux

    DistantLaughter July 15, 2025 at 1:02 AM
  • The "meaning crisis" trend. How do you answer it as an Epicurean philosopher?

    DaveT July 14, 2025 at 11:15 AM
  • Major Renovation In Use of Tags At EpicureanFriends.com

    Cassius July 13, 2025 at 3:58 PM
  • Welcome Poul

    Cassius July 13, 2025 at 6:41 AM
  • Episode 290 - TD20 - To Be Recorded

    Don July 13, 2025 at 12:15 AM
  • Welcome DistantLaughter!

    DistantLaughter July 12, 2025 at 9:28 PM
  • Lucretius Today Episode 289 Posted - "Epicureans Are Not Spocks!"

    Cassius July 10, 2025 at 12:09 PM
  • Episode 289 - TD19 - "Epicureans Are Not Spocks!"

    Cassius July 10, 2025 at 12:03 PM

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