1. New
    1. Member Announcements
  2. Home
    1. Get Started - Activities
    2. Posting Policies
    3. Community Standards
    4. Terms of Use
    5. Moderator Team
    6. Site Map
    7. Quizzes
    8. Articles
      1. Featured Articles
    9. All Blog Posts
      1. Elli's Blog / Articles
  3. Wiki
    1. Wiki Home
    2. FAQ
    3. Classical Epicureanism
    4. Physics
    5. Canonics
    6. Ethics
    7. Search Assistance
    8. Not NeoEpicurean
    9. Foundations
    10. Navigation Outlines
    11. Key Pages
  4. Forum
    1. New Activity
    2. New Threads
    3. Welcome
    4. General Discussion
    5. Featured
    6. Activism
    7. Shortcuts
    8. Dashboard
    9. Full Forum List
    10. Level 3+
    11. Most Discussed
  5. Podcast
    1. Lucretius Today Podcast
    2. Episode Guide
    3. Lucretius Today At Youtube
    4. EpicureanFriends Youtube Page
  6. Texts
    1. Overview
    2. Diogenes Laertius
    3. Principal Doctrines
    4. Vatican Sayings
    5. Lucretius
    6. Herodotus
    7. Pythocles
    8. Menoeceus
    9. Fragments - Usener Collection
    10. Torquatus On Ethics
    11. Velleius On Gods
    12. Greek/Latin Help
  7. Gallery
    1. Featured images
    2. Albums
    3. Latest Images
    4. Latest Comments
  8. Calendar
    1. Upcoming Events List
    2. Zoom Meetings
    3. This Month
    4. First Monday Zoom Meetings
    5. Wednesday Zoom Meeting
    6. Twentieth Zoom Meetings
    7. Zoom Meetings
  9. Other
    1. Featured Content
    2. Blog Posts
    3. Files
    4. Logbook
    5. EF ToDo List
    6. Link-Database
  • Login
  • Register
  • Search
This Thread
  • Everywhere
  • This Thread
  • This Forum
  • Forum
  • Articles
  • Blog Articles
  • Files
  • Gallery
  • Events
  • Pages
  • Wiki
  • Help
  • FAQ
  • More Options

Welcome To EpicureanFriends.com!

"Remember that you are mortal, and you have a limited time to live, and in devoting yourself to discussion of the nature of time and eternity you have seen things that have been, are now, and are to come."

Sign In Now
or
Register a new account
  1. New
    1. Member Announcements
  2. Home
    1. Get Started - Activities
    2. Posting Policies
    3. Community Standards
    4. Terms of Use
    5. Moderator Team
    6. Site Map
    7. Quizzes
    8. Articles
      1. Featured Articles
    9. All Blog Posts
      1. Elli's Blog / Articles
  3. Wiki
    1. Wiki Home
    2. FAQ
    3. Classical Epicureanism
    4. Physics
    5. Canonics
    6. Ethics
    7. Search Assistance
    8. Not NeoEpicurean
    9. Foundations
    10. Navigation Outlines
    11. Key Pages
  4. Forum
    1. New Activity
    2. New Threads
    3. Welcome
    4. General Discussion
    5. Featured
    6. Activism
    7. Shortcuts
    8. Dashboard
    9. Full Forum List
    10. Level 3+
    11. Most Discussed
  5. Podcast
    1. Lucretius Today Podcast
    2. Episode Guide
    3. Lucretius Today At Youtube
    4. EpicureanFriends Youtube Page
  6. Texts
    1. Overview
    2. Diogenes Laertius
    3. Principal Doctrines
    4. Vatican Sayings
    5. Lucretius
    6. Herodotus
    7. Pythocles
    8. Menoeceus
    9. Fragments - Usener Collection
    10. Torquatus On Ethics
    11. Velleius On Gods
    12. Greek/Latin Help
  7. Gallery
    1. Featured images
    2. Albums
    3. Latest Images
    4. Latest Comments
  8. Calendar
    1. Upcoming Events List
    2. Zoom Meetings
    3. This Month
    4. First Monday Zoom Meetings
    5. Wednesday Zoom Meeting
    6. Twentieth Zoom Meetings
    7. Zoom Meetings
  9. Other
    1. Featured Content
    2. Blog Posts
    3. Files
    4. Logbook
    5. EF ToDo List
    6. Link-Database
  1. New
    1. Member Announcements
  2. Home
    1. Get Started - Activities
    2. Posting Policies
    3. Community Standards
    4. Terms of Use
    5. Moderator Team
    6. Site Map
    7. Quizzes
    8. Articles
      1. Featured Articles
    9. All Blog Posts
      1. Elli's Blog / Articles
  3. Wiki
    1. Wiki Home
    2. FAQ
    3. Classical Epicureanism
    4. Physics
    5. Canonics
    6. Ethics
    7. Search Assistance
    8. Not NeoEpicurean
    9. Foundations
    10. Navigation Outlines
    11. Key Pages
  4. Forum
    1. New Activity
    2. New Threads
    3. Welcome
    4. General Discussion
    5. Featured
    6. Activism
    7. Shortcuts
    8. Dashboard
    9. Full Forum List
    10. Level 3+
    11. Most Discussed
  5. Podcast
    1. Lucretius Today Podcast
    2. Episode Guide
    3. Lucretius Today At Youtube
    4. EpicureanFriends Youtube Page
  6. Texts
    1. Overview
    2. Diogenes Laertius
    3. Principal Doctrines
    4. Vatican Sayings
    5. Lucretius
    6. Herodotus
    7. Pythocles
    8. Menoeceus
    9. Fragments - Usener Collection
    10. Torquatus On Ethics
    11. Velleius On Gods
    12. Greek/Latin Help
  7. Gallery
    1. Featured images
    2. Albums
    3. Latest Images
    4. Latest Comments
  8. Calendar
    1. Upcoming Events List
    2. Zoom Meetings
    3. This Month
    4. First Monday Zoom Meetings
    5. Wednesday Zoom Meeting
    6. Twentieth Zoom Meetings
    7. Zoom Meetings
  9. Other
    1. Featured Content
    2. Blog Posts
    3. Files
    4. Logbook
    5. EF ToDo List
    6. Link-Database
  1. EpicureanFriends - Home of Classical Epicurean Philosophy
  2. Forum
  3. Ethics - How To Live As An Epicurean
  4. Practical Applications and Epicurean Lifestyle
  5. Dealing With Death, Dying, And Old Age
  • Sidebar
  • Sidebar

"Serenely Quitting Life's Theater When The Play Has Ceased To Please Us" -- Issues Surrounding Suicide And End-Of-Life Decisions

  • Cassius
  • July 7, 2019 at 12:11 PM
Regularly Checking In On A Small Screen Device? Bookmark THIS page!
Sunday Weekly Zoom.  This and every upcoming Sunday at 12:30 PM EDT we will continue our new series of Zoom meetings targeted for a time when more of our participants worldwide can attend.   This week our special topic will be: "Is Pain Properly Considered To Be An Evil?" To find out how to attend CLICK HERE.
  • Online
    Cassius
    05 - Administrator
    Points
    102,258
    Posts
    14,000
    Quizzes
    9
    Quiz rate
    100.0 %
    • July 7, 2019 at 12:11 PM
    • #1

    I don't have time for a long post but I wanted to start a discussion. First and foremost however let's repeat the reliable major text references as to the general desirability of life, and the general undesirability of death:

    Life Is Desirable - From The Letter to Menoeceus:

    But in the world, at one time men shun death as the greatest of all evils, and at another time choose it as a respite from the evils in life. The wise man does not deprecate life nor does he fear the cessation of life. The thought of life is no offense to him, nor is the cessation of life regarded as an evil. And even as men choose of food not merely and simply the larger portion, but the more pleasant, so the wise seek to enjoy the time which is most pleasant and not merely that which is longest. And he who admonishes the young to live well and the old to make a good end speaks foolishly, not merely because of the desirability of life, but because the same exercise at once teaches to live well and to die well. Much worse is he who says that it were good not to be born, but when once one is born to pass quickly through the gates of Hades. For if he truly believes this, why does he not depart from life? It would be easy for him to do so once he were firmly convinced. If he speaks only in jest, his words are foolishness as those who hear him do not believe.

    Vatican Saying 38:

    "He is of very small account for whom there are many good reasons for ending his life."

    And We Know That Epicurus Enjoyed His Life Until He Died Naturally (From the Letter to Idomeneus):


    "On this blissful day, which is also the last of my life, I write this to you. My continual sufferings from strangury and dysentery are so great that nothing could increase them; but I set above them all the gladness of mind at the memory of our past conversations. But I would have you, as becomes your lifelong attitude to me and to philosophy, watch over the children of Metrodorus."

    On The Other Hand, We Know This From Torquatus in On Ends:

    "So on the other hand a strong and lofty spirit is entirely free from anxiety and sorrow. It makes light of death, for the dead are only as they were before they were born. It is schooled to encounter pain by recollecting that pains of great severity are ended by death, and slight ones have frequent intervals of respite; while those of medium intensity lie within our own control: we can bear them if they are endurable, or if they are not, we may serenely quit life's theater, when the play has ceased to please us." (Emphasis Added)

    With that as background:

    Let's discuss end of life issues, specifically including under what circumstances an Epicurean would choose suicide. Is it safe to say that those times when we are diagnosed with a painful and inevitably fatal disease that Epicurus would advise that we explore the option of terminating our own lives rather than endure prolonged pain from which no relief is reasonably to be expected and which overwhelms any available pleasure? Should we remain alive so long as any pleasure remains available, no matter the cost in pain?

  • Cassius July 8, 2019 at 9:27 AM

    Changed the title of the thread from “"Exiting the Play When It Ceases To Please Us" -- Issues Surrounding Suicide And End-Of-Life Decisions” to “"Serenely Quitting Life's Theater When The Play Has Ceased To Please Us" -- Issues Surrounding Suicide And End-Of-Life Decisions”.
  • Cassius November 22, 2019 at 7:09 PM

    Moved the thread from forum General Discussion to forum Death and Dying.

Unread Threads

    1. Title
    2. Replies
    3. Last Reply
    1. Daily life of ancient Epicureans / 21st Century Epicureans 38

      • Like 3
      • Robert
      • May 21, 2025 at 8:23 PM
      • General Discussion
      • Robert
      • May 29, 2025 at 1:44 PM
    2. Replies
      38
      Views
      2.2k
      38
    3. Pacatus

      May 29, 2025 at 1:44 PM
    1. Emily Austin's "LIving For Pleasure" Wins Award. (H/T to Lowri for finding this!)

      • Like 4
      • Cassius
      • May 28, 2025 at 10:57 PM
      • General Discussion
      • Cassius
      • May 28, 2025 at 10:57 PM
    2. Replies
      0
      Views
      177
    1. Confusion: "The feelings are only two" 49

      • Like 3
      • Rolf
      • May 26, 2025 at 2:10 PM
      • General Discussion
      • Rolf
      • May 28, 2025 at 1:09 PM
    2. Replies
      49
      Views
      1.2k
      49
    3. Rolf

      May 28, 2025 at 1:09 PM
    1. Brain-storming Ideas for Future Study Groups 10

      • Like 3
      • Kalosyni
      • May 10, 2025 at 11:45 AM
      • General Discussion
      • Kalosyni
      • May 27, 2025 at 3:27 PM
    2. Replies
      10
      Views
      380
      10
    3. Patrikios

      May 27, 2025 at 3:27 PM
    1. Words of wisdom from Scottish comedian Billy Connolly 5

      • Like 4
      • Don
      • May 25, 2025 at 8:33 AM
      • General Discussion
      • Don
      • May 25, 2025 at 12:27 PM
    2. Replies
      5
      Views
      341
      5
    3. Don

      May 25, 2025 at 12:27 PM

Latest Posts

  • Welcome DerekC!

    Cassius May 30, 2025 at 12:31 PM
  • Episode 282 - Is A Trifling Pain A Greater Evil Than The Worst Infamy?

    Bryan May 29, 2025 at 5:45 PM
  • Sunday Zoom - How to Attend - Summer 2025

    Cassius May 29, 2025 at 3:57 PM
  • Daily life of ancient Epicureans / 21st Century Epicureans

    Pacatus May 29, 2025 at 1:44 PM
  • Happy Birthday General Thread

    Cassius May 29, 2025 at 4:12 AM
  • Emily Austin's "LIving For Pleasure" Wins Award. (H/T to Lowri for finding this!)

    Cassius May 28, 2025 at 10:57 PM
  • Confusion: "The feelings are only two"

    Rolf May 28, 2025 at 1:09 PM
  • Brain-storming Ideas for Future Study Groups

    Patrikios May 27, 2025 at 3:27 PM
  • First Monday Monthly Zoom - 8pm ET

    Kalosyni May 27, 2025 at 2:27 PM
  • Sunday Zoom: "Discussion on the Forum FAQ Section" - Sundays @ 12:30pm EDT

    Kalosyni May 26, 2025 at 2:31 PM

EpicureanFriends - Classical Epicurean Philosophy

  1. Home
    1. About Us
    2. Classical Epicurean Philosophy
  2. Wiki
    1. Getting Started
  3. Frequently Asked Questions
    1. Site Map
  4. Forum
    1. Latest Threads
    2. Featured Threads
    3. Unread Posts
  5. Texts
    1. Core Texts
    2. Biography of Epicurus
    3. Lucretius
  6. Articles
    1. Latest Articles
  7. Gallery
    1. Featured Images
  8. Calendar
    1. This Month At EpicureanFriends
Powered by WoltLab Suite™ 6.0.22
Style: Inspire by cls-design
Stylename
Inspire
Manufacturer
cls-design
Licence
Commercial styles
Help
Supportforum
Visit cls-design