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Food and Medicine in the Time of the Epicureans in Ancient Greece and Rome

  • Kalosyni
  • May 31, 2022 at 9:33 AM
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  • Kalosyni
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    • May 31, 2022 at 9:33 AM
    • #1

    This thread is for food (and food as medicine) in the time of Epicureans in ancient Greece and Rome.

    ****

    Regarding honey in ancient times:

    Quote

    In Athens, beekeeping was so organized that the great legislator Solon (640-558 BC) was forced to define by law the distances that should exist between apiaries so as not to create misunderstandings about the ownership of flocks.


    They did not have sugar, but they had honey, as part of their diet and medicine.


    Quote

    Some of the ways in which the ancient Greeks used honey in their daily lives were the following:

    Acid honey. Honey with vinegar. How to deal with fever.

    Apple honey. Apples preserved in honey throughout the year. The honey acquired the characteristic smell of apples. They parsed the same recipe with other fruits.

    Mead honey. Liqueur resulting from alcoholic fermentation of honey.

    Melikrato. Honey with milk. Food for children.

    Wine honey. Honey with wine. It is reported that Democritus lived to a ripe old age because he consumed wine honey with bread.

    Hippocrates excludes the beneficial effect of “wine honey” on healthy and sick, Pythagoras finds that honey eliminates fatigue, while Democritus writes about well-being and longevity because of honey.

    Display More
    Honey in the life of the ancient Greeks - Asterios Bio
    The art of beekeeping is not something new in Greece. On the contrary, it has been proven that honey played a leading role in the daily life of the ancient…
    asteriosbio.com
    Honey in history: Ancient Greece
    Greece has always been a land with beautiful and various flora. Honey bees have always been at home here. Today their excellent honey is sold all over the…
    healthywithhoney.com
  • Root304
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    • May 31, 2022 at 3:37 PM
    • #2

    Awesome! All this mention of honey takes me back to my homebrewing days where I made a lot of mead (as well as beer).

  • beasain
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    • June 9, 2022 at 8:51 AM
    • #3
    Quote from Root304

    a lot of mead

    How did you basically prepared it?

  • beasain
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    • June 9, 2022 at 8:56 AM
    • #4
    Quote from Kalosyni

    Regarding honey in ancient times

    Do you know about the use of propolis in antiquity as an antibiotic?

  • Kalosyni
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    • June 9, 2022 at 11:06 AM
    • #5

    beasain, I just looked up about propolis, and found an online article which says that

    Greek and Roman physicians used it as mouth disinfectant and as an antiseptic and healing product in wound treatment, prescribed for topical therapy of cutaneous and mucosal wounds.

  • beasain
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    • June 9, 2022 at 11:32 AM
    • #6

    Kalosyni, thanks a lot for this article. Apart from the mentioned information, it is also a review of the different therapeutic benefits of this bee product.

  • Pacatus
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    • July 21, 2022 at 5:43 PM
    • #7

    Kalosyni

    They were wiser about bees than we are. I recently read an article about Canadian blueberry farmers, who are seeing diminished yields because of the lack of bees for pollination (even with travelling beekeepers). Where we live now (in town), when we take a walk, we see plenty of white clover and areas where wildflowers have been planted – but hardly any bees (likely due to pesticides).

    When we lived at Terrapin Branch, I used to sit under a large, blooming Hawthorn tree – near our small blooming cherry orchard – and you could literally feel the hum of the thousands of bees. (We also seeded our yard space with clover.)

    The lowly honey bee would be an appropriate symbol for the Epicurean Garden.

    "We must try to make the end of the journey better than the beginning, as long as we are journeying; but when we come to the end, we must be happy and content." (Vatican Saying 48)

  • Joshua
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    • August 21, 2022 at 10:44 PM
    • #8

    I have also brewed mead, which was drinkable if only just. From memory, the process was simple and my equipment rather non-technical. It consisted primarily of taking a clean glass vessel of a fair size, adding together water, citrus and honey, mixing in the yeast--did I proof the yeast? I don't remember--and fixing a common party balloon over the mouth of the vessel. Prick the balloon with a needle--in its contracted state, the hole will close to prohibit outside yeast and bacteria.

    But set all of this aside in a warmish spot, and soon the brew begins to bubble. The releasing gases will inflate the balloon enough to open the prick hole, releasing the gas. This also supplies positive pressure, so that the hole in the balloon only vents, and does not admit outside air. As the fermentation progresses, and the brew runs out of sugar, the balloon will go limp again. The mixture, now properly mead, is ready to be filtered and drunk. This process can take several weeks.

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    • August 21, 2022 at 11:05 PM
    • #9

    When I toured the Jack Daniel's distillery, I was surprised to see that they opened the fermentation vats and allowed people to peek their heads in. But when the brew comes out fermented, distilled, and charcoal filtered, it's 40 percent alcohol and they spray it on your hands as a sanitizer.

    Somebody did an analysis of all of the species of wood used in surviving furniture from Pompeii and Herculaneum; acacia, alder, ash, beech, boxwood, walnut, wild olive, willow, making up stools, crates, tables, bedframes, and shrines to the household gods. There's a particularly poignant cradle on rockers.

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    Don
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    • August 22, 2022 at 6:29 AM
    • #10
    Quote from Joshua

    mead

    Mead is having a bit of a renaissance lately. I must say I enjoy a glass every once in awhile and we have some excellent meadery establishments in the area including:

    Order Online | Feisty Mead

    Meadery | Cleveland,OH | Western Reserve Meadery
    Western Reserve Meadery, a Cleveland, OH Meadery making a variety of mead styles (honey wines). Dry meads, sweet mead, sparkling mead, melomels and metheglins.…
    www.westernreservemeadery.com
    BottleHouse
    The BottleHouse Brewery is an GABF award winning, community centric brewery, meadery and cidery. Focusing on barrel aged sours, real cider and artisanal mead.…
    www.bottlehouse.co

    I'm sure nothing surpasses Joshua 's homemade, balloon-pinhole method, but they all do a good job! :)

  • Kalosyni
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    • September 11, 2022 at 11:17 AM
    • #11

    Here is an interesting link to diet in ancient Greece:

    Ancient Recipe: Ptisane [Barley Water] (Greek, at least 5th century BCE)
    “[Barley] groats belong to the wheat family. They have juice that is quite nourishing and tenacious.” ~ Aelius Galenus (Galen), De alimentorum facultatibus (On…
    passtheflamingo.com
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    • September 11, 2022 at 11:41 AM
    • #12

    Thanks, Kalosyni !

    For completeness, I'm going to post the maza recipe that author links to in that article too:

    Ancient Recipe: Maza (Ancient Greek, ca. 2nd millennium BCE)
    “My maza comes to me from my spear, from my spear comes my Ismarian wine, and I drink while leaning on my spear.” ~ the Greek warrior-poet Archilochus explains…
    passtheflamingo.com

    The significance is that that is the *exact* word Epicurus uses in the (in)famous "bread and water" statement in the letter to Menoikeus.

    PS: I'm still trying to find barley flour to be able to try the maza recipe :)

  • Cassius
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    • September 11, 2022 at 12:38 PM
    • #13

    Comes from my spear...? Meaning what?

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    Don
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    • September 11, 2022 at 12:46 PM
    • #14
    Quote from Cassius

    Comes from my spear...? Meaning what?

    It means he gains his bread and wine through his military exploits. He earns them by means of his military prowess.

    The Swiss Army Spear
    Archilochus Fr. 2 (West) Thanks to the spear I’ve got kneaded barley cake, And thanks to the spear Ismarian wine too. And so I recline and drink, thanks to the…
    sententiaeantiquae.com
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    • September 11, 2022 at 9:18 PM
    • #15
    Quote


    It means he gains his bread and wine through his military exploits. He earns them by means of his military prowess.

    Somewhat similar to the phrasing used in the film Troy;

    Quote

    Nestor: How many battles have we won off the edge of his sword? This will be the greatest war the world has ever seen. We need the greatest warrior.

  • Kalosyni
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    • September 12, 2022 at 11:09 PM
    • #16

    This has good info:

    Ancient Greek cuisine - Wikipedia

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    Don
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    • September 12, 2022 at 11:23 PM
    • #17
    Barley Pita Bread
    When many think of Greek Food, they think of pita bread.  In truth, the Ancient Greeks enjoyed all sorts of breads, both flat and formed, but I thought it…
    anthrochef.com

    Okay, this one looks interesting. Not sure how "ancient" it is with yeast and wheat flour, but this is what I have in mind to try with the other recipes

  • smoothiekiwi
    Guest
    • September 16, 2022 at 3:00 PM
    • #18

    I‘ve to admit, it all looks incredibly tasty… I think that I have a few good ideas for college. Thanks :)

  • Kalosyni
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    • September 23, 2022 at 3:56 AM
    • #19

    Ancient Honey Cakes! And Birthday Cakes!

    Excerpt from a website with a recipe (but this one has nuts):

    Quote

    One of the foods mentioned several times in my novel are honey cakes, which are offered up to the gods in thanks. I was intrigued by the idea of these cakes and how I could recreate them today. What were their origins? Why did the ancients offer up cakes to their deities?

    If any of the ancient myths are to be believed, the gods of ancient Greek and Roman antiquity loved a bountiful meal. The stories left to us by Ovid, Herodotus, Virgil, Homer and others are ripe with stories of grand feasts enjoyed by the gods, or the gods meddling in mortal banquets such as the feast of King Midas in which all of the food tragically turned to gold. In fact, for centuries beyond ancient times, the wedding celebrations of Cupid and Psyche and Peleus and Thetis have been common artistic subjects for vases, frescoes and paintings of the great masters.

    The feasts on Mount Olympus were similar to those enjoyed on earth save in abundance, superior taste, luxury and perhaps the addition of the divine ambrosia. A traditional ancient Roman banquet would have begun with eggs and ended with fruit, and the final course was often accompanied by sweet desserts such as cake.

    Cake is a dish that has been around for thousands of years, and was enjoyed by the ancient Egyptians well before the Greeks and Romans had their fill. Paintings in the tomb of Pharaoh Ramesses II, who ruled from 1304 to 1237 B.C.E. show what archaeologists think might be a type of folded honey cake, likely made from flour, eggs, honey, dates and nuts. The Egyptian specialty feteer meshaltet, which is a thin folded pastry (and might even be the precursor to the French croissant), is descended from these cakes.

    One of the first printed recipes for honey cake appears in Athenaeus’ Deipnosophistae, published in Greece in 180 B.C.E.. It is called Enkhytoi and the book describes it as a flat, molded cake made from honey, fine flour and eggs. Like many recipes of the time there were no proportions listed, but modern recreations of these cakes show us that the consistency is that of a sponge cake.

    Birthday cakes are also ancient, as the first century poet, Ovid, wrote about in his elegiac letters, titled Tristia,..."

    Display More

    Logic might have it that honey cakes very well could have been eaten at the monthly 20th celebrations? Just an idea that is fun to think about. I do wonder if there are recipes without the nuts.

  • Kalosyni
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    • September 25, 2022 at 7:31 PM
    • #20

    This recipe looks interesting, but I would guess this is a modern version of honey cake (no nuts). I like how she says it is good with coffee or tea, and you just make it an call some friends over, lol.

    Greek Honey Cake
    Simple and extra moist Greek honey cake! Honey Cake Watch the Video My extra moist Greek honey cake is light, sweet, and has a lot of honey flavor. Orange zest…
    www.dimitrasdishes.com
  • Kalosyni February 24, 2023 at 5:33 PM

    Moved the thread from forum General Discussion And Navigation to forum Greek and Roman Customs / Food / Clothing.

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