Posts by Don

Quote from Cassius

I don't think the article came to Martin's attention because it was the best science available or particularly well written. It's more of a data point give a current generic summary of arguments we seen thrown around by average people (to the extent average people get around to discussing the issue).

Oh, I didn't mean to insinuate that I faulted Martin for anything! I completely fault the author for putting that drivel out into the world to begin with.

And I understand your point about knowing what's being said and having a summary of the pseudo-intellectual drivel that comes dangerously close (or crosses into) to the "just asking questions" strategy.

I see no evidence for "intelligence" - benevolent or otherwise - inherent in the cosmos or the wider universe. That which is held up as "evidence" requires a suspension of critical thinking that I am unwilling to partake in.

I just skimmed the original article, including reading the authors "credentials" and sour grapes ranting at the end, and my primary reaction is "those are several minutes of my life I'll never get back."

Quote from Joshua

By this logic we should disregard all laboratory experiments.

Quote from Cassius

We have all the evidence we need to conclude firmly that life is a product of natural processes and did not originate from a supernatural intelligence.

Both of those

Substack provides *anybody* a platform. Anybody can "publish" a book now. My other primary result from that Yates article is to know to avoid anything by Yates now.

with my usual caveats ...

The first two lines in the original are not imperatives (commands) but declarative statements. So...

1. The course is not to be feared.
2. Failure is free of guilt.

The second line is originally something like "free of suspicion" or Death is free of suspicion (that something is bad about it). I used poetic license on using "guilt."

scurra Atticus: the clown of Athens

scurra m (genitive scurrae); first declension

1. elegant man about town, dandy, rake
2. jester, joker, wit, clown

Atticus: (in general) of or pertaining to Attica or Athens, Attic, Athenian

Chrysippa is simply the feminine form of Chrysippus, playing on his "father" figure status, basically giving him a "mother's" name.

Horace: You do not understand what Chrysippus,[*] the father [of your sect], says...

Scaife Viewer | Satyrarum libri

Welcome aboard!

Coryphaeus:

Etymology

Borrowed from Latin coryphaeus, from Ancient Greek κορυφαῖος (koruphaîos, “leader of the chorus in an Ancient Greek drama”), from κορυφή (koruphḗ, “top of the head, crown”) (possibly ultimately from Proto-Indo-European *ḱerh₂- (“head, top; horn”)) + -ῐος (-ĭos, suffix forming adjectives meaning ‘belonging to, pertaining to’).

coryphaeus (plural coryphaeuses or coryphaei)

(Ancient Greece, drama, historical) The conductor or leader of the chorus of a drama.

Synonym: coryphée

(by extension) The chief or leader of an interest or party.

Synonyms: coryphe, coryphée

The leader of an opera chorus or another ensemble of singers.

Good quotes, Kalosyni .

It literally just hit me as I read the Menoikeus quote that:

Quote from Letter to Menoeceus

[132] "For it is not continuous drinkings and revelings, nor the satisfaction of lusts, nor the enjoyment of fish and other luxuries of the wealthy table, which produce a pleasant life, but sober reasoning, searching out the motives for all choice and avoidance, and banishing mere opinions, to which are due the greatest disturbance of the spirit."

A pleasant life is produced by sober reasoning etc. Epicurus doesn't tell Menoikeus that the sum total of a pleasant life is sober reasoning etc but that such a life is produced by those things.

From my own commentary on that section:

Rearranging the Greek into a more "English order":

οὐδ᾽ ὅσα πολυτελὴς τράπεζα ἰχθύων καὶ τῶν ἄλλων ἀλλὰ νήφων λογισμὸς φέρει τὸν ἡδὶν γεννᾷ βίον

"and nor does an extravagant table of fish and other things bring forth a sweet life but self-controlled reasoning [does bring forth a sweet life]."

Good quotes, Kalosyni .

It literally just hit me as I read the Menoikeus quote that:

Quote from Letter to Menoeceus

[132] "For it is not continuous drinkings and revelings, nor the satisfaction of lusts, nor the enjoyment of fish and other luxuries of the wealthy table, which produce a pleasant life, but sober reasoning, searching out the motives for all choice and avoidance, and banishing mere opinions, to which are due the greatest disturbance of the spirit."

A pleasant life is produced by sober reasoning etc. Epicurus doesn't tell Menoikeus that the sum total of a pleasant life is sober reasoning etc but that such a life is produced by those things.

From my own commentary on that section:

Rearranging the Greek into a more "English order":

οὐδ᾽ ὅσα πολυτελὴς τράπεζα ἰχθύων καὶ τῶν ἄλλων ἀλλὰ νήφων λογισμὸς φέρει τὸν ἡδὶν γεννᾷ βίον

"and nor does an extravagant table of fish and other things bring forth a sweet life but self-controlled reasoning [does bring forth a sweet life]."

Quote from Lucian

Hermes. Unanimous verdict for Pleasure.

And the crowd goes wild!

At the risk of stating the obvious to everyone: Porch = Stoics (The "Stoics" held their teaching in the Stoa Poikile, the "Painted Porch" in Athens. Lucian's Greek text itself has Στοά Stoá )

Quote from Lucian

The question now before you is this: are men to live the lives of swine, wallowing in voluptuousness, with never a high or noble thought?

I had forgotten about this connection of Epicureans with pigs. So both Horace and Lucian make use of this. And Horace lived 65-8 BCE; Lucian 125 – after 180 CE... So that metaphor had/has some legs!

🐷🐷🐷🐷🐷

My vision of the jar is oil and water. They don't mix.

But we could add different colors of water, signifying different pleasures.

I'm just blue skying it.

This is great work, Bryan .

Quote from Bryan

We could draw a line from "subtlety" to "simple living" if it was otherwise established, but I do not see that it is.

The closest I have is in The Double Indictment (section 2) Lucian has Zeus complain "I myself have to do any number of tasks that are almost impossible to carry out on account of their subtlety (ὑπὸ λεπτότητος)" -- which may be enough to draw it all together and preserve the manuscripts reading.

I see LSJ cites Plato, Laws, in their definition, so maybe applicable:

Plato, Laws, section 646b

Ἀθηναῖος: τί δέ; σώματος, ὦ ἑταῖρε, εἰς πονηρίαν, λεπτότητά τε καὶ αἶσχος καὶ ἀδυναμίαν, θαυμάζοιμεν ἂν εἴ ποτέ τις

Athenian: And how about plunging into a bad state of body, such as leanness or ugliness or impotence? Should we be surprised if a man of his own free will ever

LSJ defines that use as "thinness, meagreness, of body"

Quote from Kalosyni

Quote from Don

Quote from Rolf

All in all, rather unsettling.

Took the words right out of my mouth ... so to speak (pun unintentionally intended now that I wrote that )

I also found it unsettling.

It's sort of the uncanny valley transposed to the audio instead of video environment.

Uncanny valley - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Quote from kochiekoch

Epicurus beer!!!

Epi-Coors-us?

Quote from Eikadistes

I'd also add, the Canon.

Agreed.

I'd just add that we trust the Canon because, as a foundation, we have confidence that we live in a material world governed by knowledge laws and not capricious supernatural entities.

Chicken and egg? Does trust in Nature come first or does trust in the Canon come first so we can have trust in Nature?

See also

Henry George Liddell, Robert Scott, A Greek-English Lexicon, πίστις

Henry George Liddell, Robert Scott, A Greek-English Lexicon, π , πισσόχριστος , πίστ-ωμα

Quote from Cassius

"Trust" or "Faith" implies an object which we are trusting or having faith in. As general term in an Epicurean context, what would be that object?

Nature as in "the way things are."

In some contexts like Epicurus, I'd prefer "trust" instead of "faith" to get away from other religious contexts.

πῐ́στῐς • (pĭ́stĭs) f (genitive πῐ́στεως or πῐ́στῐος); third declension

trust in others, faith

belief in a higher power, faith

the state of being persuaded of something: belief, confidence, assurance

trust in a commercial sense: credit

faithfulness, honesty, trustworthiness, fidelity

that which gives assurance: treaty, oath, guarantee

means of persuasion: argument, proof

that which is entrusted

AI reveals new details about a famous Latin inscription

An analysis of the Res Gestae Divi Augusti using AI reveals its legal tone and imperial messaging, offering new insights missed by historians.

www.sciencenews.org

Okay, now this seems to be a positive use of AI in research. From the opening paragraphs:

Quote

Researchers used an AI system called Aeneas to analyze the supposedly autobiographical inscription, which translates to “Deeds of the Divine Augustus.” When compared with other Latin texts, the RGDA inscription (as it is known) shares subtle language parallels with Roman legal documents and reflects “imperial political discourse,” or messaging focused on maintaining imperial power — an insight not previously noted by human historians, researchers report July 23 in Nature.

Quote from Rolf

All in all, rather unsettling.

Took the words right out of my mouth ... so to speak (pun unintentionally intended now that I wrote that )

Okay, one last post for now on this, directly relating AI to dangerous skepticism (which we rightly rail against here on the forum):

Our Shared Reality Will Self-Destruct in the Next 12 Months

What happens when you can't trust photos, videos, text, or the entire web?

open.substack.com