Posts by Twentier
Listen to the latest Lucretius Today Podcast! Episode 225 is now available. Cicero Argues That A Commitment To Virtue Is A Bar to Pleasure.
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Epicurus Middle-Aged Epicurus Elderly
Metrodorus Hermarchus
Philodemus Lucretius
I'll upload these to the gallery, too. These are my wife's interpretations of the characters about which I have been telling her. Among other points, she maintains that all of the Greek men would have had much less manicured hair than depicted in statues, and the same for their beards, except Philodemus, in particular, whom she demands was a particularly attractive man, being a foreigner who made friends with Roman aristocrats. She also made some slight alterations based on common features found in those families that have traditionally inhabited Mytilene, versus Northern Turkey, versus ancient Syria, versus ancient Roman, and then cross-referenced with the available busts that we have. She made a lot of artistic choices to try to incorporate their personalities or dispositions, so I hope you find them to be entertaining and provocative. Cheers!
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Many of you know that I have spent a fair part of the last 8 years or so making memes and images as a product of my Epicurean study. To be frank, the only reason I had (as a musician and writer) the ability to make cheap, visual designs was because of the professional subscriptions my wife had to the digital tools she required to perform her job as a graphic designer, photo editor, photographer proper, and costume designer.
For many years now, her visual art has evolved toward the genre of neo-Classicism, and she has contributed to our artistic community through portraits of friends, family, and commissioned acquaintances, as a development from her productions as a seamstress and editor. Her approach is eclectic and relies of a variety of material sources, including her own photographic library as a photographer and, as well as her imagination and mouse.And she nearly died in April.
After years of parallel projects, and collaboration with my musical creations, she has found inspiration in the stories I have shared with her of Epicurus, and my project of providing an Epicurean alternative to Christian and Platonic expressions of art, some of the seeds of our tribe have come to fruition in her mind, and lead to the budding of Epicurean art, in the imaginative, dramatic style of oil-based neo-Classicism, through an analogue hand.
The other two project I shared were quiet experiments she explored, unbeknownst to me. This one is a proper creation in her preferred style. She has been recently inspired by my manic rants about the Epicurean rock against the Deluge of mystical confusion, and based on my recent study, I have contributed some names and narratives to her designs of our Hegemon and the historical events to which her comported.
We imagine, as Epicurus dies, bravely, willfully, boldly, having already lost hist oldest friends, Polyainos and Metrodoros, having lost his parents, and his deeply devoted brothers, and those members of his generation (who would have, proverbially, been enjoying Beatles and the Stones), while they rest were left with the generation of Leonteus' and Themistas, and Leontion, the widow of Metrodoros (who would all have been listening to Pink Floyd and Zeppelin in the name of the classical jams), and the children of his non-Epicurean friends, among his devoted disciples, and slaves (whose lives deserve greater light), including the future publisher and philosopher proper, Mys, a philosopher, teaching, and publishing in his own Right, and, as we imagine, Demetria, the alleged partner of Hermarchus, who is, otherwise, unattested in Epicurus' final two writings, thus, leading to this unique scene where Mys documents the official transition of the Garden from Epicurus' ownership, as documented by his beloved, trusty, philosophical companion, to Amynomachus, who stares, uncomfortably, not an Epicurean, but a grandson of the tradition that raised him beneath the wing of natural confidence and friendship and kindness and forgiving and empowerment, in overwhelming, youthful contemplation, as the wise Demetria, having loved Epicurus, having known him for years, living in the Garden with Hermarchus, though his attention is temporarily elsewhere, having inherited the duties of the Scholarch as the Hegemon ... we witness the Savior suffering from explicit endocrine failure (most likely, days before reaching sepsis and organ failure), an excruciating, untreatable condition that leads to certain death, which was met, fearlessly, with intention and purpose ... we notice Demetria, who looks onward, remembering the Second Kuria Doxa, that her wise friend has only ever guided her to light, herself, making peace with the shadows of the painting: death sucks. She is fighting the tears of losing a healthy part of her life that deserves immortal glory. Perhaps Timocrates sits in the perspective of the viewer of this work. Perhaps Timocrates, as was the case with the inheritors of Epicurus property, were economically bound to their daily jobs as non-Epicureans, yet devoted to the natural friendship that inspires them to honor Hermarkhos and the future ... the Garden of Epicurus is a collection of seeds, planted by faithful compatriates, who will never see them bloom, struggling through the arresting melancholy of the death of friends, fighting, spiritually, to remember of older brother's teachings, that we deserve joy, and that The Dead might bet upon memorial joy. We commemorate The Inheritance as might the Christians' "Annunciation" and "Adoration" and "Ascension".
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https://ccel.org/ccel/schaff/npnf102/npnf102.iv.XI.5.html
QuoteNext, we must see what reply can be made to those who agree that God is the Creator of the world, but have difficulties about the time of its creation, and what reply, also, they can make to difficulties we might raise about the place of its creation. For, as they demand why the world was created then and no sooner, we may ask why it was created just here where it is, and not elsewhere. For if they imagine infinite spaces of time before the world, during which God could not have been idle, in like manner they may conceive outside the world infinite realms of space, in which, if any one says that the Omnipotent cannot hold His hand from working, will it not follow that they must adopt Epicurus’ dream of innumerable worlds? with this difference only, that he asserts that they are formed and destroyed by the fortuitous movements of atoms, while they will hold that they are made by God’s hand, if they maintain that, throughout the boundless immensity of space, stretching interminably in every direction round the world, God cannot rest, and that the worlds which they suppose Him to make cannot be destroyed...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_City_of_God
It still surprises me that we can talk about (and scholars talk about, and the ancients talk about) the demise of the Epicurean school... and yet Augustine of Hippo (354-430 CE), writing in the 400s CE, can *still* be railing against Epicurus and his philosophy. As Joshua has pointed out, Augustine wrote that the ashes of Stoicism and Epicureanism are so cold that not a single spark can be struck from them against Christianity (Ep. 118.12). And yet, he feels compelled to include a dig against them in his City of God. Was he trying to convince others or himself that the Epicurean "ashes" were so cold?
Earlier, Theophilus of Antioch (115~183/5 CE) includes slanders against both the Stoics and Epicureans in his letter To Autolycus (Ad Autolycum 3.6):
QuoteAnd Epicurus himself, too, as well as teaching atheism, teaches along with it incest with mothers and sisters, and this in transgression of the laws which forbid it; for Solon distinctly legislated regarding this, in order that from a married parent children might lawfully spring, that they might not be born of adultery, so that no one should honour as his father him who was not his father, or dishonour him who was really his father, through ignorance that he was so. And these things the other laws of the Romans and Greeks also prohibit. Why, then, do Epicurus and the Stoics teach incest and sodomy, with which doctrines they have filled libraries, so that from boyhood this lawless intercourse is learned? And why should I further spend time on them, since even of those they call gods they relate similar things?
It seems the early Christians were SO threatened by the Epicureans (and Stoics) that they just railed and railed against them endlessly. From that alone, it appears that Epicurus's school continued to have great significance and impact well into the "Christian" era.
From everything I've read, I have gotten a few impressions:
(1) We overestimate the amount of people in the Roman Empire who actually identified as "Christian" by 400 CE. Just because the Emperor passed an edict, and just because a State passed a declaration does not necessarily mean that all of those living within the jurisdiction of that system had mentally converted to that tradition. (The government of China versus the religious practices of the majority of its population serves as a good example.)
(2) We underestimate the popularity of Neoplatonism during the same time period that Christianity was rising in numbers. This was particularly problematic (much more so than any threat of Epicureanism) because a number of the early Christian Church Fathers (who are still accepted in Christian culture as Saints and guides) were Middle Platonists, (first) and Christians (second). Neoplatonism was a mystical, providential competitor with Nicene Christianity.
(3) We overlook the influence of the Christian heretics. Well into the Middle Ages, Nicene Christians were still fighting the heresies of Arianism and Nestorianism. Many of these heretics were influenced by the notion that some element of Jesus was flesh-and-blood, thus, in the same way that Fascists tend to call everyone remotely left of them Communists (or vis-a-versa), everyone who doesn't agree with Nicene Christians were "Epicureans", or some other slur.
(4) We also overlook the influence of Gnosticism throughout the Empire. During this same time period, Mandaeism and Manichaeism developed and began claiming thousands of converts, particularly among the Persian community which contributed Zoroastrian themes to their practice. Like the heretics, they believed in some divinity of Jesus of Nazareth and/or John the Baptist, and yet, still, they were not considered "Christian" by the Church Fathers.
(5) Along that same line of Persian influence, we also overlook the influence of the Cult of Mithra. This seems to have been (at least, at the beginning of the Roman Empire) the dominant spiritual tradition of Roman soldiers, and had a particular presence among men who previously practiced mystery rites. This cult was a competitor with Nicene Christianity, heretical Christian sects, Gnostics, Middle Platonists, and Neoplatonists.
So, it may not necessarily have been the case that the spark of Epicureanism was extinguished by the deluge of Christianity, but rather, was both (a) being appropriated as a slur for the opponents of any forms of Idealism, and (b) was competing in a plural world where no one ideology claimed over 50% of the population.
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I think that sex cannot be necessary, because many people are not healthy enough to have sex, and Epicurus reminds us that one is never too young, nor too old, nor too impotent to tend to the health of one's soul.
(We also might be thinking about this in terms of celibate adults, but let's keep in mind that most children are not having sex, and they can still enjoy the natural pleasure of wisdom; and even then, the natural pleasure that is sex does not become available until a certain point in a person's life, so we might even say it is unnatural below a certain age).
Also, not that anyone was making this point, but just to share this perspective: we have no obligation to the species to reproduce. It is no one person's duty to perpetuate the genes of ancient creatures just because one shares their DNA.
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It is definitely useful to see these things in their context. For example;
In a letter scholars have dated to c. 355, Julian the Apostate was commenting on the political inaction of the Epicureans;
https://en.m.wikisource.org/wiki/Letter_to…the_philosopher
Another letter from the same advocates the Suppression of Epicurean texts;
https://en.m.wikisource.org/wiki/Fragment_…ter_to_a_priest
QuoteLet us not admit discourses by Epicurus or Pyrrho; but indeed the gods have already in their wisdom destroyed their works, so that most of their books have ceased to be. Nevertheless there is no reason why I should not, by way of example, mention these works too, to show what sort of discourses priests must especially avoid; and if such discourses, then much more must they avoid such thoughts. For an error of speech is, in my opinion, by no means the same as an error of the mind, but we ought to give heed to the mind first of all, since the tongue sins in company with it.
By edict of a pagan emperor in a letter to one of his priests, Epicureanism becomes thought crime. It is actually worse in his view to think about than to speak about it, because speech is vulnerable to correction and purgation while thought is not.
The 15th century Florentine iconoclast priest Savonarolo would be proud.
Quote“Listen women,” he preached to the crowd, “They say that this world was made of atoms, that is, those tiniest of particles that fly through the air.” No doubt savoring the absurdity, he encouraged his listeners to express their derision out loud: “Now laugh, women, at the studies of these learned men.”
A few decades after the reign of Julian came St. Augustine's survey of the situation -- "The ashes of Epicureanism are so cold that not a single spark can be struck from them."
Within two centuries of Diogenes Laertius, there was almost nothing left.
Julian is an interesting figure (as I've recently found), in being a refreshing, polytheistic alternative to the growing, mystical Christian cult, who was equally Platonic, and therein anti-Epicurean in his education. This is particularly interesting, in that at least four early Church Fathers, as recognized by the Catholic and Orthodox churches, were admitted Platonists who not only rode the wave of Plutarch's Middle Platonism, but positively inhaled the Neoplatonism of Saccas, Plotinus, Porphyry, and Iamblichus, who derived their adaptations based off explicitly Indian forms of super-natural, supra-mental, or ascetic expressions of religious devotion. It's an interesting period.
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Thank You!
Quote from CassiusAlso for future reference, you indicated this morning that you found a better "keyword" to use in searching for something like this better than "timeline." Do you recall what that was?
Well, that's the trouble; there is the Gantt Chart which is infuriatingly close to what we need, and may actually be helpful in feeding a growing table of data into a chart maker. But it has it's downsides. For one thing, the resulting chart will almost always be longer vertically than horizontally, which means a pretty massive file for the amount of data presented.
Also, every one I've seen has the labels in a column on the left rather in the chart itself.
I just don't know how to search for this;
https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Time…ian_history.jpg
without finding a lot of this:
Josh, thank you for sharing this map. I think that this interdisciplinary approach is integral to a genuine interface with these ancient ideas, on their own terms. You'll see soon (as I think you also intend) to demonstrate those ideologies that functionally replaced the popularity of atomism (I'm fascinated by Gnosticism and Christian Heretics [heterodoxy} in particular) and I believe that incorporating a visual estimation of the popularity of mysticism, albeit is Gnosticism [The narrative of John the Baptist (x) Middle Platonism] or Pauline Christianity [Judaism (x) Mithraism (x) Imperial Worship (x) honestly, IDK, Saul of Tarsus' weird, personal affectations], we are looking at literal "Magic" that become more digestible to Greco-Roman peoples in terms of safety and security than Roman tolerance of *material* Polytheism.
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Wasn't there a scholarch with a Roman name? Source amnesia on that one.
I'm thinking you mean Popilius Theotimus. He's the only listed Scholarach with a Latin familiar name.
There also seems to be some suggestion that after somewhere between Apollodorus the "Tryant" and Zeno of Sidon there was a fracture of inheritance that lead to some level of involvement from characters like Diogenes of Tarsus, the Ptolemys of Alexandria, and perhaps Orion the otherwise unattested Epicurean. I believe that is speculative.
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I'm wondering if Twentier and Don can help clear up the succession of scholarchs for me. I was going by the link to the table posted by Cassius in #1, but then I found this list by Nate at Society of Epicurus and some of the dates don't match.
Protrarchus isn't mentioned at all in the table Cassius linked to, but does appear in SoFE list. The dates for Apollodorus are completely conflicting.
Nate, should I go with the list you posted at SoFE? It looks more complete.
I recently realized that a number of those dates from my study are inaccurate. Mostly, some of the more fragmentary characters are estimated, and one of my sources seems to have mixed-up BCE and CE in a few entires.
Given that, in a bizarre wave of serendipity, I have been scouring that document for the last few weeks to improve upon it and add additional Epicureans that have been found since Herculaneum papers continue to be decoded.
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I'm wondering whether anybody else has come across him. I know Hiram has delved deeply into Philodemus' scrolls. I'm just wondering if he should be on our radar?
Yes, and I am currently curious which Caecilius is Caecilius.
Right now, I am juggling with the possibility that he is just a character in "Octavius" by Minucius Felix".
I came across the possibility that he is Caecilius Statius. He (Caecilius "the Epicurean") could also be Titus Pomponius Atticus, whom was later called Quintus Caecilius Pomponianus Atticus.
Granted, the Romans, as I now realize, had a very, very limited number of first names, as an individual's identify was largely informed by their heritage, thus, driving modern historians to insanity ... so there were a ton of Quintus Caecilius' out there, and, regarding "Statius", we have, at least, Caecilius Statius the comic poet, whose works contrast with those of Horace such to give us reason to be suspicious of an Epicurean pedigree.
I have no answers to this.
Only one request:
Moving forward, let's all give our kids unique names. There are an innumerable amount of familiar names, and the Romans, who were emaculate with their historiography, only had about 6 names for boys.
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Twentier This is beautiful (the other one also)! I just ordered the large one from Etsy. There is a big blank white wall in front of my desk, where it will hang!
I am glad you like it! I will be sure to pass along that compliment to my wife.
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I *really* like that one.
Thank you! I'll pass along that compliment.
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One other print she's done that she posted: https://www.etsy.com/listing/158761…N_re-qfdOzQz0r8
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Twentier, thanks for sharing, very nice! Since the description doesn't say a print of an original oil or acrylic painting, then wondering if these are text-to-image designs?
Also, seeing Epicurus in a red toga got me curious, as I seem to remember reading that philosophers wore white...but I need to find a reference for that (so do not yet have reference source for that).
Based on my understanding, the "white toga" is a bit of a historical misnomer. The toga is a Roman-specific piece of garb whereas the Greeks wore tunics and chitons (among a number of other styles). Clothing was typically colorful and included a variety of dyes, as much as people have always used dyes and pigmentation as an aesthetic. (Lee, Mireille M. Body, dress, and identity in ancient Greece. New York: Cambridge University Press, 2015).
Outside of graphic design, Gen is a seamstress and costume designer, and has an extensive knowledge base when it comes to the history of fashion and clothing design, so I defer to her artistic choices as far the red goes.
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I hope you'll be able to encourage her to do more like this. And do I see that she's done more than one work on Epicurus? I tried to follow links on the etsy page but was not sure how to look for the rest of her work.
She does have a number of designs that I will be sharing soon!
I initially asked her to make some renderings for my Hedonicon ("Epicurean Bible"), which I'll be sharing soon. I will share the other renderings she has done soon, as well. One of her specialties is to take portraits and turn them into Renaissance-styled paintings, and she's advanced to making realistic renderings, so we'll have some to share.
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Gen has been a digital artist for over a decade, so everything is done with a digital tools. However, she does neither use AI Optimization Enhancement tools nor does she use text-to-image designs.
In our opinion (her's, specifically), that would be copyright infringement. No one should be selling text-to-image designs.
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Christian heresy has always really fascinated me.
Incidentally, I have been reading a lot about Marcion recently and the development of Biblical Canon. It is interesting to view Christianity at a time before orthodoxy developed, and explore how we view those figures from history.
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Exceptional research, Don. Thank you for sharing!
This is an engaging and welcome read after a few days helping my wife through her last surgery.