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  1. EpicureanFriends - Classical Epicurean Philosophy
  • Sidebar
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Thomas Jefferson Thomas Jefferson, to William Short, October 31, 1819
I take the liberty of observing that you are not a true disciple of our master Epicurus, in indulging the indolence to which you say you are yielding. One of his canons, you know, was that “that indulgence which prevents a greater pleasure, or produces a greater pain, is to be avoided.” Your love of repose will lead, in its progress, to a suspension of healthy exercise, a relaxation of mind, an indifference to everything around you, and finally to a debility of body, and hebetude of mind, the farthest of all things from the happiness which the well-regulated indulgences of Epicurus ensure; fortitude, you know is one of his four cardinal virtues. That teaches us to meet and surmount difficulties; not to fly from them, like cowards; and to fly, too, in vain, for they will meet and arrest us at every turn of our road. Weigh this matter well; brace yourself up....
Latest Lucretius Today Podcast
Episode 356 — "The Skeptics Argue All Sides But Conceal Their Conclusions"
Website Overview Forum Navigation Map News & Forum Updates Recent Activity

Recent Activities

  • Patrikios October 21, 2026 at 6:16 PM

    Replied to the thread How a Defense of Christianity Revolutionized Brain Science article.
    Post
    Godfrey It is an interesting read.

    On the story of the Presbyterian minister, It appears to me that Bayes’s premise—that these statistical models are somehow validated by their historical roots in defending religious miracles—is a distraction.…
  • Cassius October 21, 2026 at 10:41 AM

    Replied to the thread David Sedley - "Creationism And Its Critics In Antiquity".
    Post
    I will be adding comments to this thread as I review this book, and the first thing I see to address is this statement from Dr. Sedley about his interest in exploring the history of the debate about creationism. (The underlining is my own addition.)

    […]…
  • Cassius October 21, 2026 at 10:00 AM

    Replied to the thread Collection of Nietzsche Quotes Relevant To Epicurean Philosophy.
    Post
    This following is a more exhaustive list of references prepared by Claude. It addresses simply a request to compile a list of references both positive and negative. Within that scope I think it succeeds pretty well, and provides a set of links for…
  • Cassius October 20, 2026 at 2:27 PM

    Posted the thread Oxyrhynchus Papyrus - Work By Eikadistes at Twentiers.com.
    Thread
    I just heard from Eikadistes that he's been working on the Oxyrhunchus materials. Haven't had a chance to review it yet but his work is always of high quality so we definitely want to link to it here:



    https://twentiers.com/oxyrhynchus/
  • Godfrey October 20, 2026 at 12:06 PM

    Posted the thread How a Defense of Christianity Revolutionized Brain Science article.
    Thread
    Happy 20th!

    This from my morning reading may be of interest:

    https://nautil.us/how-a-defense-…800e2773da38d79
  • Cassius October 20, 2026 at 11:23 AM

    Replied to the thread Episode 356 - EATAQ38 - The Skeptics Argue Every Side But Conceal Their Conclusions.
    Post

    Summary

    Continuing Book Two of Cicero’s Academic Questions, Cassius and Joshua finish Section 18, where Lucullus calls the skeptics’ appeal to “the probable” a “monstrous absurdity”: if the true cannot be told from the false, even “probably…
  • Cassius October 20, 2026 at 9:57 AM

    Replied to the thread Episode 356 - EATAQ38 - The Skeptics Argue Every Side But Conceal Their Conclusions.
    Post
    Lucretius Today Podcast Episode 356 is now available: "The Skeptics Argue All Sides But Conceal Their Conclusions"

    spreaker.com/episode/75876565/media
  • Kalosyni October 20, 2026 at 9:25 AM

    Posted the thread Happy Twentieth of October 2026.
    Thread


    Happy Twentieth Everyone! :)
  • Cassius October 20, 2026 at 8:39 AM

    Posted the thread David Sedley - "Creationism And Its Critics In Antiquity".
    Thread
    […]

    Thanks again to Godfrey for bringing this book to my attention. Its focus is much wider than Epicurus alone but it has excellent material on the Epicurean viewpoint. I am not going through it for the first time and so I am setting up this thread for…
  • Cassius October 20, 2026 at 8:36 AM

    Replied to the thread Episode One Hundred Twenty-Seven - Letter to Pythocles 02 - The Formation of "Worlds".
    Post
    […]

    Somehow four years ago I neglected to follow up on Godfrey's citation to this book. I have now remedied that and see that it is indeed excellent - another good source that compares and contrasts what Epicurus was doing against Plato's works. It…
  • Cassius October 18, 2026 at 8:23 PM

    Replied to the thread Episode 355 - EATAQ37 - Have We Lived All Our Lives In A House of Mirrors?.
    Post
    Wow!
  • Bryan October 18, 2026 at 4:23 PM

    Replied to the thread Episode 355 - EATAQ37 - Have We Lived All Our Lives In A House of Mirrors?.
    Post
    […]


    While looking up Lucretius' use of the word "Verā́trum," I found this info about Carneades.



    Pliny, Natural History, 25.21:

    "In former days hellebore was regarded with horror, but more recently the use of it has become so familiar, that numbers of…
  • Cassius October 18, 2026 at 4:19 PM

    Replied to the thread Epicurean Pleaure and Enjoyment Differs Depending on Introvert vs. Extrovert Brain Differences.
    Post
    I will look at the article but I want to note at the top that I don't think that there is ultimately any Epicurean endorsement of either "extrovert" or "introvert" orientation, except perhaps at a very basic level of appreciating the value of friendship…
  • Kalosyni October 18, 2026 at 3:46 PM

    Replied to the thread Epicurean Pleaure and Enjoyment Differs Depending on Introvert vs. Extrovert Brain Differences.
    Post
    Bryan This thread is relevant to what came up in this afternoon's Zoom discussion.
  • Cassius October 17, 2026 at 11:44 AM

    Replied to the thread Episode 356 - EATAQ38 - The Skeptics Argue Every Side But Conceal Their Conclusions.
    Post
    I am adding this summary prepared with Claude to EpicurusToday.com:

    https://epicurustoday.com/02-key-sources/identicalthings/
  • Cassius October 17, 2026 at 10:42 AM

    Replied to the thread Episode 356 - EATAQ38 - The Skeptics Argue Every Side But Conceal Their Conclusions.
    Post
    When we finished last week we were grapplying with the following statement by Lucullus (the Stoic), and we will start again with it this week, from Section 18 of Book 2 -

    And that must be very absurd which you sometimes are in the habit of saying, when…
  • Cassius October 17, 2026 at 10:15 AM

    Posted the thread Episode 356 - EATAQ38 - The Skeptics Argue Every Side But Conceal Their Conclusions.
    Thread
    Welcome to Episode 356 of Lucretius Today. This is a podcast dedicated to the poet Lucretius, who wrote "On The Nature of Things," the most complete presentation of Epicurean philosophy left to us from the ancient world. Each week we walk you through the…
  • Kalosyni October 17, 2026 at 10:09 AM

    Replied to the thread Ancient Greek/Roman Customs, Culture, and Clothing.
    Post
    […]

    I can't find any source that says "styled and trimmed", just this:

    Alciphron's Letters of Parasites, translation by A. R. Benner and F. H. Forbes, as quoted in The Mask of Socrates, the relevant sentence reads: “And there was the Epicurean…
  • Bryan October 17, 2026 at 1:14 AM

    Replied to the thread Ancient Greek/Roman Customs, Culture, and Clothing.
    Post
    “The Epicureans wore styled and trimmed beards” I do not see the source for this information in the article… do we know where the source is?
  • Cassius October 16, 2026 at 5:38 PM

    Posted the thread Excellent Article By Eikadistes On The "Epicurean Paradox" About the Gods.
    Thread
    This new article by Eikadistes is one of the best and most thorough articles on this topic I have seen.

    I suspect for years to come this will be the definitive treatment of a topic that is a source of endless confusion.

    Congratulations Eikadistes!

    …
  • Pacatus October 16, 2026 at 4:15 PM

    Replied to the thread Episode 355 - EATAQ37 - Have We Lived All Our Lives In A House of Mirrors?.
    Post
    […]

    Yes. Absolutely. But it can take time, education and effort (and often some kind of therapy) to unravel conditioning (often fear-baesd) that begins at very early age, and becomes subconsciously embedded (I have before compared it to a long, slow,…
  • Cassius October 16, 2026 at 4:07 PM

    Replied to the thread Episode 355 - EATAQ37 - Have We Lived All Our Lives In A House of Mirrors?.
    Post
    Summary

    Continuing Book Two of Cicero's Academic Questions, Cassius and Joshua go back through Section 18 in detail, focusing on the figure at the center of Lucullus's epistemology: the Stoic wise man, who withholds his assent from anything that could…
  • Cassius October 16, 2026 at 3:54 PM

    Replied to the thread Episode 355 - EATAQ37 - Have We Lived All Our Lives In A House of Mirrors?.
    Post
    As I see it at least one huge problem with both Plato's cave and any allegory that we are living in a house of mirrors is this: Who gives Plato the right to suggest that nature is the equivalent of a set of manipulators who are holding us in chains…
  • Pacatus October 16, 2026 at 3:42 PM

    Replied to the thread Episode 355 - EATAQ37 - Have We Lived All Our Lives In A House of Mirrors?.
    Post
    Oh agreed. But I also think that often people seem to "defraud" themselves into such beliefs, mostly from fear and social/cultural conditioning. (I know I did for many years.)
  • Cassius October 16, 2026 at 2:46 PM

    Replied to the thread Episode 355 - EATAQ37 - Have We Lived All Our Lives In A House of Mirrors?.
    Post
    […]

    That's definitely the word used in philosophic discussion, but I think it's far too generous and sounds much too nice to adequately describe what is really going on. Plato and the Stoics aren't saying "Why not the best?" They are saying "I don't…
  • Cassius October 16, 2026 at 1:17 PM

    Replied to the thread EpicureanFriends Provisional AI Posting Policies.
    Post
    […]

    I completely agree as to society in general. Here, however, we can hold people to that standard.
  • Pacatus October 16, 2026 at 12:53 PM

    Replied to the thread Episode 355 - EATAQ37 - Have We Lived All Our Lives In A House of Mirrors?.
    Post
    […]

    In a word: Idealism. Michael Onfray in his Hedonist Manifesto pretty much lays it all back on Plato -- And Plato's successors (e.g. Christianity, Kant):

    "There is only this: the real, matter, life, and living. Platonism declares war on all of it,…
  • Cassius October 16, 2026 at 12:25 PM

    Replied to the thread Episode 355 - EATAQ37 - Have We Lived All Our Lives In A House of Mirrors?.
    Post
    Also - as we go forward in the coming weeks, i am going to suggest that there is a common thread - a common denominator - a common problem - shared by both the Plato's cave analogy and the house of mirrors analogy - that Epicurus is revealing to us as…
  • Pacatus October 16, 2026 at 12:16 PM

    Replied to the thread EpicureanFriends Provisional AI Posting Policies.
    Post
    […]

    I'm not going to swing back into the AI debates. I will just say that only a little critical observation of society -- including business and politics -- suggests those expectations are at least a bit naïve.
  • Cassius October 16, 2026 at 12:00 PM

    Replied to the thread Episode 355 - EATAQ37 - Have We Lived All Our Lives In A House of Mirrors?.
    Post
    I think this is a good episode covering important points, including one with which we closed the episode, in which Lucullus (the Stoic) thows an accusation at the Skeptics:

    […]



    We'll return to this in the upcoming episode so any suggestions as to the best…
  • Cassius October 16, 2026 at 11:40 AM

    Replied to the thread Episode 355 - EATAQ37 - Have We Lived All Our Lives In A House of Mirrors?.
    Post
    Lucretius Today Podcast Episode 354 is now available: "Have We Lived All Our Lives In A House Of Mirrors?"

    spreaker.com/episode/75827181/media
  • Kalosyni October 16, 2026 at 8:09 AM

    Replied to the thread Ancient Greek/Roman Customs, Culture, and Clothing.
    Post
    Edit note: I have not been able to find textual sources for the following information regarding Epicureans.

    […]

    Source

    *****

    Edit note on October 17, 2026: have not found a true source for the phrase "styled and trimmed".
  • Cassius October 15, 2026 at 5:34 PM

    Replied to the thread EpicureanFriends Provisional AI Posting Policies.
    Post
    Over the last 20 years probably no single person has had more of an impact on developments in the computer world than Linus Torvalds, the creator of Linux, the software kernel that runs so much of the computer world today.

    I don't consider Torvalds to be…
  • Cassius October 15, 2026 at 3:56 PM

    Replied to the thread The Full Epicurean Reasoning Regarding a Material Universe.
    Post
    Thanks for the link. I think I've seen people link to this before but I've never listened myself and it would be interesting to get feedback from those who have.

    In the meantime, I have to question the attention to detail, or sympathy to Epicurus, of a…
  • Kalosyni October 15, 2026 at 2:27 PM

    Replied to the thread The Full Epicurean Reasoning Regarding a Material Universe.
    Post
    Beyond just reading Book 3 of Lucretius, this lecture could be helpful regarding the nature of the soul:

    m.youtube.com/watch?v=cB39d7GhXJo
  • wbernys October 15, 2026 at 11:42 AM

    Replied to the thread Epilepsy in Epicureanism.
    Post
    […]

    Let's just hope I don't die looking like a porcupine as well lol.
  • Cassius October 15, 2026 at 11:18 AM

    Replied to the thread Epilepsy in Epicureanism.
    Post
    Good luck Wbernys! As to epilepsy I suppose there is no more famous (traditional) example than Julius Caesar, as I am sure you've heard, so you're in prestigious company.
  • wbernys October 15, 2026 at 10:39 AM

    Posted the thread Epilepsy in Epicureanism.
    Thread
    Hello all, I apologize for missing the Wednesday meeting. I was getting discharged from the hospital.

    I then got a nasty toothache so all around had a shitty week, I managed to learn the truth of both sides of the coin of PD4, I have general epilepsy,…
  • Cassius October 15, 2026 at 9:24 AM

    Posted the thread Philosophical Implications of Jason And The Argonauts.
    Thread
    I am setting up this thread as a placeholder for potential future discussion of the story of Jason and the Argonauts. This comes to mind because there is a well known 1963 movie version which I recently came across, and due to the recent rise of…
  • Kalosyni October 15, 2026 at 8:52 AM

    Replied to the thread The Full Epicurean Reasoning Regarding a Material Universe.
    Post
    Here are my notes from last night's Zoom meeting:

    Apologies as these are pretty rough. After the topic was presented, we went around the Zoom circle to ask for thoughts. I did not take note of who said what, so these are anonymous.

    ***

    atomic theory -->…
  • Cassius October 15, 2026 at 5:57 AM

    Replied to the thread The Full Epicurean Reasoning Regarding a Material Universe.
    Post
    We had a good discussion of this topic in our live meeting of October 14.

    It's not enough just to have a passing familiarity with genera Epicurean physics or even atomnism. Simply granting that the universe is made of particles does not at all guarantee…
  • Kalosyni October 14, 2026 at 7:17 PM

    Replied to the thread The Full Epicurean Reasoning Regarding a Material Universe.
    Post
    Creating a concise explanation would also be the basis and reasoning behind recognizing that the soul is mortal and that the gods are indifferent.

    This might be of interest: Chapter 2 - "Atomic Worlds" of Catherine Wilson's book Epicureanism: A Very Short…
  • Kalosyni October 14, 2026 at 6:43 PM

    Posted the thread The Full Epicurean Reasoning Regarding a Material Universe.
    Thread
    I wanted to start this thread so that we can create a concise explanation of the reasoning from start to finish about how we come to understand that the universe is a material universe. This would be based on both Letter to Pythocles and Letter to…
  • Cassius October 13, 2026 at 9:05 PM

    Replied to the thread Episode 354 - EATAQ36 - The "Monstrous Absurdity" of Academic Skepticism.
    Post
    […]

    To really hone in on the issue, we probably need to be very clear about what it would mean "to be the same cat." I presume that two cats might be absolutely identical in every way, even potentially in experience, but the key issue is whether THEY…
  • kochiekoch October 13, 2026 at 7:45 PM

    Replied to the thread Revisiting Issues of The Use of AI in Epicurean Philosophy.
    Post
    […]

    Talking to ourAI's?! 🤖Sounds crazy! 😄
  • kochiekoch October 13, 2026 at 7:13 PM

    Replied to the thread Episode 354 - EATAQ36 - The "Monstrous Absurdity" of Academic Skepticism.
    Post
    Good point! :)

    CC the cat was apparently her own cat, with an entirely different personality than Rainbow, her colorful progenitor. No doubt largely from different life experiences and environmental influences. CC lived the life of a well taken care of…
  • Cassius October 13, 2026 at 5:57 PM

    Replied to the thread Episode 354 - EATAQ36 - The "Monstrous Absurdity" of Academic Skepticism.
    Post
    […]

    Yes i think that's part of the picture, of which I think there are at least two parts.

    (1) Differences in atomic combinations will be almost astronomically impossible to duplicate.

    (2) But, given the infinity of space and the eternality of time, it is…
  • Cassius October 13, 2026 at 5:43 PM

    Replied to the thread Revisiting Issues of The Use of AI in Epicurean Philosophy.
    Post
    […]

    I would say it is, and also similar to what Jefferson said to William Short about the pitfalls of giving in to indolence, as per the quote currently on the forum's front page.
  • Cassius October 13, 2026 at 5:38 PM

    Posted the thread Welcome MarcyRIzzi.
    Thread
    Welcome marcyrizzi , who tells us:

    […]

    Thank you for registering at EpicureanFriends.com, and for writing to us about your background and interest in Epicurus. We look forward to hearing more from you!

    As a reminder, all posts are subject to our Community…
  • kochiekoch October 13, 2026 at 5:23 PM

    Replied to the thread Episode 354 - EATAQ36 - The "Monstrous Absurdity" of Academic Skepticism.
    Post
    This episode reminds me of a story. The very first pet ever cloned was named CC, for Copy Cat or Carbon Copy. It surprised me in that CC had a different coat other than her progenitor. Being genetically identical, you'd think it would be the same. Small…

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  • How a Defense of Christianity Revolutionized Brain Science article

    Patrikios October 21, 2026 at 6:16 PM
  • David Sedley - "Creationism And Its Critics In Antiquity"

    Cassius October 21, 2026 at 10:41 AM
  • Collection of Nietzsche Quotes Relevant To Epicurean Philosophy

    Cassius October 21, 2026 at 10:00 AM
  • Oxyrhynchus Papyrus - Work By Eikadistes at Twentiers.com

    Cassius October 20, 2026 at 2:27 PM
  • Episode 356 - EATAQ38 - The Skeptics Argue Every Side But Conceal Their Conclusions

    Cassius October 20, 2026 at 11:23 AM
  • Happy Twentieth of October 2026

    Kalosyni October 20, 2026 at 9:25 AM
  • Episode One Hundred Twenty-Seven - Letter to Pythocles 02 - The Formation of "Worlds"

    Cassius October 20, 2026 at 8:36 AM
  • Episode 355 - EATAQ37 - Have We Lived All Our Lives In A House of Mirrors?

    Cassius October 18, 2026 at 8:23 PM
  • Epicurean Pleaure and Enjoyment Differs Depending on Introvert vs. Extrovert Brain Differences

    Cassius October 18, 2026 at 4:19 PM
  • Ancient Greek/Roman Customs, Culture, and Clothing

    Kalosyni October 17, 2026 at 10:09 AM

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