Posts by Don

New Graphics: Are You On Team Epicurus? | Comparison Chart: Epicurus vs. Other Philosophies | Chart Of Key Epicurean Quotations | Accelerating Study Of Canonics Through Philodemus' "On Methods Of Inference" | Note to all users: If you have a problem posting in any forum, please message Cassius  

  • Article on Lucretius and "Death is Nothing to Us"

    Okay, as an experiment, I've added Epicurist as the translation of ΕΠΙΚΟΥΡΕΙΟΣ on my avatar. Just trying it on for size.

    I had the thought that I kind of like the parallel with "scientist." Epicurist philosophy? Epicuric philosophy? I realize this wordplay swims against centuries of usage of "Epicurean" so I don't expect it to "catch on." But play is pleasure so let's play a little. Let's be real: the name of the website is EpicureanFriends after all :D

    Citations from Oxford English Dictionary (earliest 1579):

    1579 Which fantasie that good man Epicurus, and all Epicuristes [Dutch Epicuristen] haue likewise followed, and stoutlie defended.

    G. Gilpin, translation of P. van Marnix van Sant Aldegonde, Bee Hiue of Romishe Church 107

    1610 Were not the Epicurists [Latin Epicurei] in great accoumpt at Athens?

    J. Healey, translation of St. Augustine, Citie of God xviii. xli. 729

    1787 I was ready to cry out with the Epicurist.

    W. Wallbeck, Fables Ded. p. xxi

    1860 He did not pause with the speculative Epicurists, who care to follow an idea only so far as it makes things easy.

    Dial April 259

    1967 The Epicurists and some Stoics condoned suicide because they embraced the point of view that death is the cure for all ills.

    Psychoanalytic Review vol. 54 424

    2011To concentrate on the present, a practice the Stoics and Epicurists valued greatly.

    C. Dunker, Constit. Psychoanalytic Clinic v. 121

  • Article on Lucretius and "Death is Nothing to Us"

    Quote

    As Lucretius summarizes in book two of On The Nature of Things, Epicurists believe the ultimate good for human nature is as follows:

    To avoid bodily pain, to have a mind free from anxiety and fear, and to enjoy the pleasures of the senses.

    I'm curious to read the whole article, but I saw this quote above and found it intriguing.

    1. I never thought of the word "Epicurist" but it's certainly more compact than "student of Epicurean philosophy."

    2. I was initially reluctant to endorse that summary, but, on reflection, that's not a bad summary. Let me explain my perspective:

    To avoid bodily pain - As long as this is interpreted to mean "avoid" and not eliminate. "Epicurists" make choices to experience pain to avoid more future pain.

    to have a mind free from anxiety and fear - I may get pushback, but I still see this as an essential part of the philosophy. A mind free from anxiety and fear is a baseline to make prudent choices and to fully experience sensual pleasures.

    to enjoy the pleasures of the senses - Yep, in all their multifariousness.

    This is all with the caveat that ANY summary is reductive and comes with issues, ex. the Tetrapharmakos. I remain an advocate for that summary while also acknowledging its shortcomings.

  • VS78 - Alternative Translation

    ὁ γενναῖος περὶ σοφίαν καὶ φιλίαν μάλιστα γίγνεται, ὧν τὸ μέν ἐστι νοητον ἀγαθόν, τὸ δὲ ἀθάνατον.

    "One who is noble in mind (ὁ γενναῖος) most of all depends upon wisdom (σοφίαν) and friendship (φιλίαν) — one is a good perceptible to the mind, thinkable, and imaginable; the other, everlasting and perpetual."

    ἀθάνατον literally means "un-dying" or "not subject to death." I've taken than as the wisdom we acquire dies with us; but friendship with others has ripples that outlive us. The impact we have on our friends lives on after we die.

  • Episode 274 - TD04 - Is The Soul Held Down By The Body, And Does Death Allow The Soul To Ascend To A Better Place?

    "Is Cicero Right That Death a Better Place?"

    I'm not saying Cicero uses the word, but if anyone tries to say something like "the afterlife is a utopia" remember that utopia literally means "no-place." Coined from Ancient Greek οὐ (ou, “not”) + τόπος (tópos, “place, region”). It's not spelled eutopia "good place." The afterlife is not a place, it does not exist. We do not exist after our death other than in the memories of the living. Make an effort to be memorable to your family, your friends. Be the best parent, partner, and friend you can be. That is your afterlife.

  • A Lovely Little Way to Refer to Memories

    "ag dul siar ar bhóithrín na smaointe"

    The Irish (Gaelic) phrase for reminiscing.

    Literally, "going back down the little lane of thoughts; going back on the road of ideas"

    bhóithrín "a small, quite often badly maintained track or lane, commonly found in rural areas."

    Think of English "taking a trip down memory lane" but I like that idea that, even if the road is badly maintained, you're still going travel down it to visit a cherished memory.

    (VERY roughly pronounced : ag dool she-ar air vo-run na shmin-cha)

  • Episode 273 - TD03 - Is The Soul Immortal And Death Actually A Good/

    Quote from Cassius

    If it's an Epicurean argument, was Cicero extending it to the existence of souls on his own, without precedent from Epicurean texts, or is it likely that the Epicureans reasoned this way in regard to souls as well as gods?

    I'm not convinced that the prolepsis of the gods includes their blessedness and incorruptibility. The prolepsis has to do with their existence. The blessedness and incorruptibility are the proper "beliefs" that we should assign to them. When Epicurus says (in the letter to Menoikeus):

    believe that the god is a blessed and imperishable thing as is the common, general understanding of the god. You, [Menoikeus], believe everything about which a god is able to preserve its own imperishability and blessedness for itself. Do not attribute anything foreign to its incorruptibility or incongruous with the blessedness of the god!

    He's using the word "believe" and "general understanding" and "attribute" not prolepsis. Then later:

    Gods exist (θεοὶ εἰσιν), and the knowledge of them is manifest to the mind's eye.

    That "enarges ἐναργὴς" or "manifest to the mind's eye" to me says that the existence of the gods is the readily discernible "knowledge" and nothing more. Then, by reason, we assign the proper common, general understanding of the god as incorruptible and blessed.

    On the other hand, the "soul" (shudder... I *really* dislike using that loaded term) is apparent because we're alive. BUT *remember* neither Epicurus nor Cicero uses our Christian-laden term "soul."

    Epicurus consistently talks about the ψυχή (psykhe - psyche) which is akin to the Latin anima. Both can refer to "the animating principle of a human or animal body, vital spirit, soul, life." The ψυχή can also be thought as the "mind" or where reason happens. It seems the big argument - then and now - was whether this seat of reason or the principle that gave animation and life to a body, human or animal, existed separately from the body or whether it came into existence with the physical body. Did it exist prior to the body or can it exist after the body decays? Or is it inextricably interwoven WITH the body, arising together and decaying together at death?

    The difference between gods and the soul/ψυχή/anima is that we can see the latter at work every time we look at a living body... or sense our own existence for that matter! No prolepsis is needed. A body is animate, it has an anima/ψυχή. A body is dead, something happened to the anima/ψυχή.

    Quote from Cassius

    Key to this analysis is that I think most of us agree that the faculty of prolepses leads toward formation of opinions, but that a prolepsis is not itself an opinion. Cicero doesn't seem to accept this, and he seems to think that an Epicurean prolepsis is a fully formed opinion, and since all men have the opinion that gods exist and that souls survive death, that makes it true. I also think most of us agree that Epicurus would say that it doesn't matter how many people think a thing to be so, that's not sufficient evidence of its truth - we should require sound reasoning based on observations from the senses, prolepsis, and feelings, and these are not subject to majority vote.

    Agreed. That's why I content that the prolepsis of the gods does not cover their blessed and incorruptibility.

  • Episode 273 - TD03 - Is The Soul Immortal And Death Actually A Good/

    Quote from Cassius

    I'm experimenting using the side-by-side format the possibility of making notes on each section of Tusculun Disputations as we go through it

    This is a great idea!! Okay, I was stalling on my Menoikeus reformating because of all the hard html coding. But this text and note format has some potential as demonstrated right here by your work, Cassius . I need to go back and look more at that side by side ... software? Template? Thing? Thanks for the practical proof of concept!

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