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Alternate Translations - Please post in the Lexicon as per the example here

It looks like we have a significant difference among sources as to how PD14 should end, so we need to have a discussion as to why that is the case, and this thread is the best place for that. This is prompted by Nate's graphic here Principal Doctrine 14 which cites Inwood and Gerson: XIV "The purest security is that which comes from a quiet life and withdrawal from the many, although a certain degree of security from other men does come by means of the power to repel [attacks] and by means of pr…

Don what about the "prosperity" part - that seems to me the most controversial aspect of the quote. I am surprised that Inwood and Gerson would deviate so far from what appears to be otherwise the consensus. That is from page 33 of the Epicurus Reader and unfortunately there appear to be no footnotes. I don't know how we can track that down but such a departure calls into question the reliability of the Epicurus Reader if there is no good reason for it.

(Quote from Cassius) Agreed Martin -- I much prefer "breaking away from the herd" to "retirement from the world."

(Quote from Cassius) And yet if the Greek really very clearly were "retirement from the world" it would probably be best to keep that. Probably the key word that bothers me is the "retirement" or "withdraw" that can be read to imply exhaustion and "giving up" - which is very different from "breaking away from the herd." Don did you opine on your ultimate view on that word? I see you were considering "go, make way, make room, withdraw, etc."

OK I will say it:. The intersection of the viewpoint of many academics with their preferred translation may well be that the academics consider everyone but themselves to be hoi polloi, and thus they see no difference between "hoi polloi" and "the world." ...which I strongly believe was *not* Epicurus' viewpoint. I believe if forced to choose, Epicurus would take the "hoipolloi" over the "golden" academics most any day of the week, as would I!

(Quote from Don) Yes exactly and I started to add that as my own reference but I didn't want to sound too argumentative this afternoon I seem to recall that DeWitt thought that Epicurus considered Plato to be a skeptic, and I think the "accepting myths" probably applied to Plato too even though that's in a section where Epicurus was referencing determinism. And I'd probably double down and say that if you accepted Plato's view of the universe you really wouldn't have much choice except to follow…

I suspect he's doing just like what a lot of us are probably doing -- making sure that we have a private retreat, but also that we're located to take advantage of most if not all of the modern conveniences.

Here is at least part of what I am remembering about Munro's commentary. The first line about not caring if it is true is not good but may be part of the old issue of self-protection. However read the part marked in red as to "sterile wisdom" and "barren virtue" and I think we have good evidence of an Epicurean heart:

(Quote from Nate) Ha! "The power to fight them off" --- as usual St Andre comes through with something memorable - and I like it! Again, THANK YOU NATE for the work in these recent postings.

(Quote from Nate) Now THIS is unusual. Nate what source is that? Given the departure from the norm in that one we may see something similar in the other ones by Geer.

I see that is on Archive.org. I wonder who Geer was and what were his credentials? https://archive.org/details/le…al00geer/page/n3/mode/2up Oops - only partly

(Quote from Don) Looks like borrowing would give access to the full book. I'll just have to find the time. Bobbs-merrill is a reputable publisher, but I'd like to know his credentials, especially since the one we're talking about seems pretty far off.

Ah I see from Nate's pages that Geer annotates 14 as very uncertain.

(Quote from Godfrey) Do you have a copy of his book? I do but it doesn't seem to contain much bio information other than that he seems to have been a professor perhaps at Northwestern which published his book?