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I haven't been here for awhile, and just finished reading through this thread. Three comments: First, I want to thank Godfrey and Don for pointing out that "natural and necessary" etc. refer to desires, not pleasures. I made that error on my personal outline, and will now correct. Second, I do not find a sharp distinction between kinetic and katastemic pleasure to be personally helpful; I tend to think of them as complementary, perhaps shading into one another. With that in mind (as I play more …